Boot Up Error Message

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 15 Apr 2006 10:05 am

Dell Dimension 2340, Win XP

On boot up I get this screen message, just starting a couple of days ago, the first time I rebooted after downloading the latest MS Update patches:

Primary master hard disk S.M.A.R.T. status bad S.M.A.R.T. error detected. The IDE hard disk drive is operating outside normal specifications. It is advisable to immediately back up your data and replace you hard disk drive.....

When I select F1 to "continue" it boots up just fine and operates normally. I have rebooted several times since with the same message, the same normal boot after hitting F1.

Any ideas? Should I try a system restore to before the MS update?

Hard disk failure---not words I particularly like.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 15 Apr 2006 11:11 am

Is this one of those BIOS messages that shows up before Windows starts loading? Or is it a Windows message?

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 15 Apr 2006 11:34 am

BIOS----black screen boot-up screen, very early in the process. Only reason I mentioned the Windows update was the timing--before update, ok, after update, this message. Doesn't have to be related, of course. I pretty much leave the computer running 24/7 so this reboot may have been the a day or so after the MS patches.

Lou[NE] · Post by **Lou[NE]** » 15 Apr 2006 11:38 am

S.M.A.R.T = Self-Monitoring Analysis and Reporting Technology. Major hard drive makers use this to monitor hard drive status and detect possible failure. Best to do a backup ASAP and start to consider replacing your hard drive. I don't think the Microsoft patch would have anything to do with the SMART error. That would be a question for Wiz.

Not what you wanted to hear, but I hope it helps.

Lou

[This message was edited by Lou[NE] on 15 April 2006 at 12:41 PM.]

erik · Post by **erik** » 15 Apr 2006 12:52 pm

I have a 10g Maxtor drive and I'm running Win98se. Now I know people will get upset with me but I occasionally get this same(similar) error. "S.M.A.R.T". Windows will not load. I have to power off with the switch. My remedy:

option 1:

Hit the desktop on the side with my fist to jar the HD

option 2:

Unlock HD, pull out and then replace

Both work, though i'm inclined to employ option 2 more often. I have NEVER experienced any issues with data after doing these things. I have done this at least 50 times over the last 2 years. YMMV.

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-johnson

[This message was edited by erik on 15 April 2006 at 01:53 PM.]

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 15 Apr 2006 2:33 pm

Hard drives used to have a typical lifespan of between 5 and 7 years, depending on the internal temperature of the computer, how many hours it was powered on and how much data was written and swapped to and from it. Those drives were precision engineered and built by skilled workers making good wages, and they cost plenty to pay for this quality. I remember paying $200 for a 4 GB hard drive, only 5 or 6 years ago.

Now-a-days a typical hard drive sells for less than $100.00, is built by foreign workers paid squat who don't care about quality controls, and typically last only 2 years!

If your hard drive is equipped with SMART, and/or is showing bad sectors or other signs of failure, it is only a matter of time before that occurs. If you have any critical files or records saved on such a hard drive you are well advised to burn that data to removable media, stored properly, and buy a new hard drive. If you don't know how to install Windows and it's drivers you should pay your local repair dude to install the new drive and drivers, then transfer your data over to a folder where you can access it.

With 80 GB hard drives selling for as low as $50 it makes no sense to dink around with an old or failing hard drive.

------------------
Bob "Wiz" Feinberg
Moderator of the SGF Computers Forum
Visit my Wiztunes Steel Guitar website at: http://www.wiztunes.com/
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Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 15 Apr 2006 2:54 pm

The reinstallation procedure on Dell's (and similar for most others) after the hard drive is formatted: (1) Install the Dell supplied OS (2) Install the Dell (motherboard) chipset drivers (some older models do not have chipset drivers) (3) install Dell device drivers (e.g. audio) (4) reinstall any Dell supplied appliations you want to reinstall (5) reinstall user applications and backed up user data (6) reinstall peripherals (e.g. printers, scanners) using the devices installation program and ONLY connect the device when the install program tells you.

One other note, specifically with Dell (although it may apply to others such as Compaq/HP, etc) is that Dell uses proprietary hardware so you need to use the Dell provided drivers. e.g. the SoundBlaster sound cards that Dell supplies are custom OEM models, not exactly like the Retail models and you must use Dell drivers. (I have a Gateway and it's all standard ATX components - nothing custom or proprietary - and the primary reason I bought the Gateway).

If you don't have all the Dell drivers and/or the latest drivers for your system you can download them from Dell. Click this link http://delltalk.us.dell.com/supportforums
and when the page comes up, click "Desktops" at the top of the page then click Dimension. Enter your service tag number and then click on Downloads and you will get a list of available downloads for your specific model.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 16 Apr 2006 5:42 am

Thanks. I'm working on long overdue backups. Then it's into territory I hoped I'd never have to go (formatting & installing new drive, etc---way over my head here).
I expect to have a bunch of embarrassingly stupid questions before then.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 16 Apr 2006 6:02 am

OK--first question:

Do I need to download anything and everything I will need for the installation NOW, before installing a new hard drive? I mean, I won't have computer use or internet access once I pull the old drive and until I have a new drive installed, right? But then when I pull the old drive I won't have the drivers....I'm all dumb & confused.

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 16 Apr 2006 7:25 am

Download every available driver and update to your applications and burn them to a CD. Once you have the new OS up and running pop in the CD as the source for the drivers and setups. If you don't have a CD burner you can download them to the old hard drive, then slave that drive to the new one and fetch the drivers off of it, hopefully before it dies.

If the old drive begins to seize up power off the system, unplug the drive, put it into a ziplock bag and put it in the freezer for about a half hour. After the half hour take it out of the freezer and baggie and hook it back up as a slave, power up and grab all the files you can get and drop them into a folder on the new drive (don't waste time trying to install from the old failing drive). You may get up to 15 or 20 minutes of life out of it before it seizes permanently. If you copy all of the downloaded drivers to the new drive you can just shut down, remove the old slave drive and reboot. The new drive will have the drivers you copied.

Do not leave the old failing drive connected once you have transferred over everything you want or need, to the new drive, or to a CD. If it fails while connected as a slave the entire computer will gring to a halt and freeze up, until you remove that drive.

------------------
Bob "Wiz" Feinberg
Moderator of the SGF Computers Forum
Visit my Wiztunes Steel Guitar website at: http://www.wiztunes.com/
or my computer troubleshooting website: Wizcrafts Computer Services,
or my Webmaster Services webpage.
Learn about current computer virus and security threats here.
Read Wiz's Blog for security news and update notices[This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 16 April 2006 at 08:26 AM.][This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 16 April 2006 at 08:29 AM.]

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 16 Apr 2006 7:57 am

If you have the original Dell supplied OS,drivers, etc you don't need to download anything. But, if you'e lost the CD's you can download all of the drivers, but not the Dell applications and not the Operating System. If you've lost the Operating System CD you will have to buy a Retail copy, it's not downloadable and Dell will not replace it (they generally only replace missing or damaged CD's in the first 21 days).

But, if you want updated drivers (if there are any updates available) then download them and burn a CD as Wiz suggested.

There may be a BIOS update available from the Dell downloads. You won't need that to reinstall everything but you can consider the BIOS update later after everything else is installed and working OK.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 16 Apr 2006 8:07 am

Great. thank you, both. I've got all the original CD material for this machine.

Should I expect that any IDE hard disk will be compatible with my system? If I were to get something with too great a capacity such as 200G or so, is the worst case scenario just that I won't be able to use all the capacity or may it just not work?

And--is there any conventional wisdom these days as to brand names to favor or to avoid? (I know that for any name there's gong to be someone with a bad experience but I'm wondering about general field ratings).

Again, thanks for the great help.

edit----------I have to ask---Ultra ATA/100 interface. Is this for me? Says nothing about IDE.[This message was edited by Jon Light on 16 April 2006 at 09:21 AM.]

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 16 Apr 2006 8:35 am

Ultra ATA is an IDE interface, and will work fine in your computer. IDE means Integrated Device Electronics (if I remember correctly) and means that the hard drive contains it's own buffer memory and geometry translation electronics. Ultra ATA means that it can transfer data at a rate in excess of 66 MB/s.

There is some common confusion about the terms IDE, SCSI, ATA and SATA. IDE indicates that the drive contains it's own operating electronics and that it tells the BIOS and motherboard IDE controller that it does it's own translation of instructions.

SCSI is a (generally) high speed, high quality, mission critical drive specification. SCSI devices can be daisy wired in series, I think up to 27 devices, including hard disks, scanners, and other cards and devices.

ATA is the common designation for the typical hard disks used for the last umpteen years, and refers to a parallel connection system. The correct designation is actually P-ATA.

SATA means Serial ATA, as opposed to parallel. SATA is the new standard and is rapidly replacing P-ATA drives in most new computers. SATA drives require special chipsets and connectors on the motherboard, or an adapter card. You probably don't want one of these unless your manual specifies it.

If you buy a hard drive that is too large to be recognized in full by the BIOS, install it anyway. Then go to Dell and download the newest BIOS and flash utility, read the instructions, burn the BIOS to a floppy (if your computer uses floppies), or follow the instructions provided and update your BIOS. Do not allow the power to go off during a BIOS upgrade. Buy a battery backup before you start this operation, if you don't already own one.

------------------
Bob "Wiz" Feinberg
Moderator of the SGF Computers Forum
Visit my Wiztunes Steel Guitar website at: http://www.wiztunes.com/
or my computer troubleshooting website: Wizcrafts Computer Services,
or my Webmaster Services webpage.
Learn about current computer virus and security threats here.
Read Wiz's Blog for security news and update notices
[This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 16 April 2006 at 09:39 AM.][This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 16 April 2006 at 09:41 AM.]

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 16 Apr 2006 8:39 am

Bueno. Gracias.