I almost sold my Black Box...

Al Terhune · Post by **Al Terhune** » 27 Oct 2005 7:17 pm

Like a number of us GAS heads, I've been looking for things to hawk to pay for "new" things, and the Black Box was on my list. When I got my BB, I really didn't do an efficient A/B with and without it, but I could tell, by ear, there was some type of "boost" in my signal and tone, although I thought it was something I could do without. Tonight I did an A/B recording direct out of my Nashville 400 into Pro Tools and finally realize, with clarity and confidence, why there are those who won't play without it. It's possible that you might get similar results with some compressors, but for me, Brad knew what he was doing with this. I most likely (never say never) won't sell mine as long as I'm playing pedal steel.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 28 Oct 2005 6:07 am

Glad to hear it Al. There have been a few SGBB owners who at first thought that what the SGBB does is subtle. But then when either performing or recording with it they discovered more clearly what it really does. I agree that the real test is to see what the tube's harmonic and dynamic effects do in the real world where the steel has to blend with other instruments. You can definitely hear the sweetening effect right away by itself, but when you are mixing the sound of the steel along with other instruments, drums, cymbals, guitars, vocals, etc. that's where the smooth presence of the SGBB really shines thru. Some of the earliest feedback came from the engineers working with Russ Pahl on that first big Gretchen Wilson album. They said that the SGBB made the steel so much less harsh and more clear that they were able to mix the steel louder and didn't have to mess with much EQ to make it "fit" in the mix.

The other important point that I stress to SGBB users is that when brand new, the SGBB needs to break in for a few dozen hours to really settle into it's real sound. New cap's and tubes simply need to be broken in. Also, when you first power up the SGBB, although the tube is working after 15 seconds, it really takes 10-20 minutes for the tube to FULLY warm up and take on the real sound. That goes for any tube device.

Thanks again Al and enjoy that BB.

Brad Sarno
www.steelguitarblackbox.com

T. C. Furlong · Post by **T. C. Furlong** » 28 Oct 2005 6:12 am

Right on Al. Brad is the real deal in my book. He has been blessed with a rare combination of electronics wizardry, curiosity and golden ears. And he's a great guy! I love my Black Box and I am so looking forward to getting Brad's new Revelation preamp.
TC

John LeMaster · Post by **John LeMaster** » 29 Oct 2005 6:49 am

I have been playing through the Steel Guitar Black Box at home for about a month now. I like the clarity and "separation" acroos the tone spectrum without the highs being shrill.

Last week, I used the SGBB for the first time in a recording session. The sound was the best I have had. I have recorded at this same studio a number of times, but this time the engineer commented about the tone, warmth and clarity of the steel guitar.

Last night, I played an outdoor Fall Festival gig here in Jacksonville. The group was one for which I have done a number of gigs previously. The lead player and the lead singer both - completely unsolicited - commented about the warmth and tone of the steel.

I have never met Brad, but he is a good person to do business with, and the SGBB is all that I expected.

The SGBB will be part of my set up for live shows, studio, or home playing.

John L.

Marlin Smoot · Post by **Marlin Smoot** » 29 Oct 2005 7:00 am

I also have Brad's Black Box and its the best investment I've ever made on any outboard gear. I wouldn't call it a compressor but it is an enhancer. Its really true, the longer its on, the better the rig sounds. Currently I use the black box and delay only with a Session 400/Emmons PP. Truly a masterpiece. In time, I'm sure I'll own everything Brad makes. By the way, if you plan on getting one, remember, the more you use it the more you understand how it works. Simple but awesome.
Jim West

richard burton · Post by **richard burton** » 29 Oct 2005 8:16 am

Why, when I used a black box, did I notice no difference?
It was as if the input and output jacks were connected direct.
I must have cloth ears, it can't be the Emperor's new clothes syndrome.

Hook Moore · Post by **Hook Moore** » 29 Oct 2005 12:17 pm

I`m not sure why Richard but I can tell you it does make a difference to me..Its like driving after dark in heavy fog and then you plug in the black box and everything becomes very clear. Harmonics are much cleaner too..
Hook

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www.HookMoore.com

Al Terhune · Post by **Al Terhune** » 29 Oct 2005 2:30 pm

Richard -- the Steel Guitar Black Box is really for people who are fantics about their sound. I don't think anybody owning one would say prior to the SGBB, nobody had clarity or good harmonics. The same sound -- or close to it -- can be obtained by use of compressors/enhancers/e.q. (or as Brad's said, a tube amp. It is specifically designed for solid states, although not totally discouraged from use with tube amps), so it's not really a miracle. We've got decades of really fine-sounding steel guitar on recordings, and they obviously achieved it without the SGBB. To some people, it's like night and day. I think that's misleading. That's when people expect miracles. It's all relative. When I was contemplating selling mine, I wanted to do a proper A/B test to make sure I wouldn't regret getting rid of it. I can only speak for myself: With the box, and listening back using headphones, there was an obvious clarity, brightness, and gain. Also, the wave on my Pro Tools was slightly compressed compared to the wave without the box, which I also consider a plus.

Could I live without it? Yes. Would the average listener be able to tell I'm using a SGBB or not? My guess is no, they can't tell and don't give a crap. Could we do a test here on the forum and fool a bunch of steelers who think they could tell the difference between what tracks are using the SGBB and which tracks are using other means of "enhancement" or perhaps none at all? You bet!!!!!!

So, in my opinion, the SGBB is only for those who are fanatics (and I mean more than just "care" -- I mean fanatical) about what their steel sounds like -- and have the extra cash to buy one.

And let's face it, some people really have picky and discerning ears (I don't, but with headphones, and listening to the track by itself, it was an obvious difference).

Al

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 29 Oct 2005 9:53 pm

It is also how your fingers interact with your amp's sound to some extent.

The BB is a direct pickup / tube lock,
so you gradually start picking your attacks
relative to the BB's interaction with the tube.

This is no doubt where many people start falling in love with it's sound.
But not neccesarily BEFORE that natural interactiion kicks in.

You control your tone by right hand picking styles and bar finese.
But you tend to play your attacks a bit differently with different amps or sounds.

I play a screaming sound much different than a smooth warm sound.

The interaction of the tube to the string attack eventually gets through your ears to your fingers.
Often without you thinking about it.

Buck Grantham R.I.P. · Post by **Buck Grantham R.I.P.** » 8 Nov 2005 5:45 pm

I never play a show without the Black Box. That is one product that does what it is supposed to. Thanks Brad

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 8 Nov 2005 6:06 pm

IMHO where the SGBB is ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL is in the studio. In that somewhat sterile environment is where the sonic benefits of the unit are unmistakeable.

Case in point. Last year I did an album with a singer/songwriter named Mike Runnels. His CD did fantastic on CDBaby.com and got lots of good press, some of which generously praised yours truly

. So we went back in the studio to cut a new album.

This time, to save weight, I showed up without the BB. Mike mentioned that my sound wasn't like the previous album. I told him about the BB not on this one and he said "oh, okay. I'm... uh... I'm sure it'll be okay." We had what I thought was a great session, cut three tunes.

That was Monday. On Wednesday, the producer called me back and said, "sorry man, but Mike really wants to cut your tracks again. It's just not the same without the Black Box, and he's kind of hooked on it. Sorry." I went back in on Friday and cut the same tracks with the BB, and Mike was happy. I was too, since he insisted on paying me again. But he made me promise to ALWAYS bring the BB to his sessions.

YMMV, but that's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

George Kimery · Post by **George Kimery** » 8 Nov 2005 9:11 pm

I plugged my Black Box in expecting to hear a dramatic change. Didn't happen. I could tell a little difference, but I didn't think it was $300.00 worth. I contacted Brad about returning it, per his guarantee. He suggested I keep it a week or so, then return it if I didn't like it. Well, Brad knew what he was doing. I don't know what happened. Either my ears got "educated" or the Black Box came alive, but after using it for a week, then taking it away, the smooth sound I was getting just left me. You couldn't pry the Black Box away from me now. I am a big fan and can definately tell a difference. The Black Box and a Hilton Pedal really makes my old Emmmons PP sing. Try the Black Box for a week and if you don't like it, Brad will refund your money. It's worth the shipping cost just to play with the thing for a week.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 12 Nov 2005 4:32 pm

Glad to hear it guys. I think there are two things happening here. First, the Black Box is a clean buffer, so the initial tonal effect may seem subtle to some. It's not EQ'ing or shaping the tone, but it is introducing and enhancing the musical (even ordered) harmonics. These harmonics really come into play when you mix the steel with other instruments. There is also a very subtle smoothing going on because tubes gently clip the peaks and spikes that come from pick attack. Once you are used to the BB, removing it reveals how dramatic the effect really is.

The other thing that may be happening and may be part of what was described in George's case is that the tube and other components do break in after a few hours of use. I recommend that a new Black Box be left on for a few days to settle in. Brand new caps, tube, and yes, even resistors, can have a relatively harder, "colder" sound compared to when they've been broken in and had some heat and high voltage and music put thru them. After a BB is really broken in from say a month or so of regular use, it'll hold that state for a long time until the tube needs replacement. We still don't know how long that is. Mine has been on 24/7 for about 19 months now and is still going strong. I'm guessing about 5-10 years of normal daily use.

Thanks!!!

Brad
www.steelguitarblackbox.com