What would you chose...

Harold Dye · Post by **Harold Dye** » 24 Oct 2004 3:34 pm

I know this has been hashed over in some form or other before. But..If given a choice which would you choose..a solid state or a tube amp. Looking at the variables...cost, weight, reliabilty, cost to maintain, power..chocolate or vanilla, which would it be? I know there are people that say they "prefer" one or the other but that aside, if someone said, here are two amps..one SS the other tube, it is your choice, pick one up and leave...which one would you choose. Why??? The reason I am asking is that many players are using tube preamps or some other means to achieve something like a tube sound.
[This message was edited by Harold Dye on 24 October 2004 at 04:37 PM.][This message was edited by Harold Dye on 24 October 2004 at 04:39 PM.]

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 24 Oct 2004 4:11 pm

Values not withstanding, I'd just go for the best sounding amp! Example: The old tube Marshall and Vox tube amps have nothing to offer me as a usable piece of gear for steel, so you can never just say either a tube amp or a transistor amp is best. It depends on the particular brand and model. From a strictly player's point of view, there's duds in both categories.

Harold Dye · Post by **Harold Dye** » 24 Oct 2004 4:22 pm

Good point Donny. As far as tubes are concerned lets consider either Fender or Music Man, amps or heads, and the current list of SS amps available today.

Jon Kostal · Post by **Jon Kostal** » 24 Oct 2004 5:43 pm

I've been using Peavey solid state amps for steel for 25 years. They are dependable and sound great. My first was an LTD 400, then a Nashville 400, and now a Nashville 112 that I think is the best sounding of the three, and only 42 lbs.! For 6-string electric I use a Tech 21 Trademark 60, only weighs 36 lbs. The solid state amps have no tubes to be replaced, no adjustments to make, so in a practical sense are easiest to use. I also own a Vox AC-30 that just drips with tone (of no use for steel) but is old and finnicky. The Tech 21 almost nails the the sound of the AC-30, and has modern features.

Everyone has an opinion............

Jon

Dennis Wood · Post by **Dennis Wood** » 25 Oct 2004 4:34 am

I have a mid 70's Fender Twin Reverb, mid 70's Peavey Session 400, peavey Nashville 400 & a Peavey Tubefex. The amps all sound great but different. The only problem i have is choosing which amp to use. Most of the time its the Nash 400 because of its compact size.

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Sierra U-12 Crown Gearless, Peavey Nashville 400,
1971 Fender Twin Reverb,
Peavey Tubefex,
Peavey Session 400,
Peavey TT Bandit w/ex speaker. Regal Reso, Tele, Strat, 1970 Les Paul Std.

James Quackenbush · Post by **James Quackenbush** » 25 Oct 2004 6:04 am

When you ask a question on which you would choose because of weight, price, dependability , etc a lot of folks would go with Solid State ....If you simply asked which one would you choose WITHOUT the above considerations, I think a lot of people would go with a tube amp ....Tube amps are generally heavier, more costly, and more costly to maintain ...There are also tubes that can go bad so they are generally not as reliable if they are not maintained .. Tone wise , I have to give the nod to Tube amps simply because of the fullness, roundness, body, etc of the tone ...Solid State amps can get very loud, but most of them in my opinion are very sterile sounding .. It's very similar to the newer digital gear that's out there...It's crystal clear sounding, but everybody is trying to get that noise free sound, only they also want that fat , full, smooth tone of the tubes so they mix and match ...The one amp that I have found that sounds more "tubey" than some of my tube amps, is the Webb !!... Unless you get a tube amp that has plenty of power, in most cases when you push the volume , the tone will distort ....Solid State amps stay a lot cleaner at high power ... Money and weight not being an issue, I would go with Tube amps probably 90% of the time..Jim

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 25 Oct 2004 6:59 am

FWIW, I had a Music Man RD 112-65 with a JBL 12" in it... I would take a Nashville 112 over that amp any day (for steel).
I've had 2 Fender Twin Reverbs, and while I would choose the Twin over the Nashville 400 I had, I would take the Session 400 I currently have over either of those Twins (again, for steel).

Concerning tube amps, I would be curious about this "Which would you choose?"... EL84's or 6L6's (and why, or, makes no difference)?

David Doggett · Post by **David Doggett** » 25 Oct 2004 7:15 am

Harold, I think silver-face Fender tube amps are the best sounding amps for pedal steel. When I learned steel back in the '70s, old used tube amps were all I could afford. When I started playing again a couple of years ago, I got a NV 400. I was thrilled at first. For the moderate volumes I played at then, it had good clean tone, with full low end, and lots of versatility in the controls. Then I tried a friends Fender SF Twin Reverb (with stock 2x12) every time we practiced at his house. There was a beautiful texture in the sound that I grew to love. The comparison would be the difference between a pure synthesizer sound and the lush sounds of orchestral strings. I borrowed his amp a few times, but stuck with my solid state Peavey.

Then I started playing with a rockabilly and alt country band (some would call it punk country) in small rock clubs. These guys played very loud, which is what the audience in those clubs expect. They are not really prepared to mic guitar amps in most of these clubs. We practice in a rented sound proof practice space. Even at practices, the NV 400 didn't have enough usable volume. I was wide open with my volume pedal bumping the floor. The volume was there, but it sounded harsh and blaring. Maybe a NV 1000, with it's extra power (300 watts vs 200) would have done the job. But I couldn't affor a new one.

I got a used Fender Vibrasonic which had been put in a Dual head cabinet, and played it through a 15" JBL that I had in a Thiele reflex cabinet. Even though the Vibrasonic was rated at half the watts of the NV 400, it seemed to play as loud, and unlike the solid state amp, the louder it played, the better it sounded. This was the answer for me. The tube amp sounded a little better at low volume, and a lot better at high volume.

Since then I have tried many tube amps. The '70s Fender silver-face Twin family amps seem best to me, and they are widely available at low prices. I now have two Super Twins (in head cabinets), a Dual Showman Reverb head, a Pro Reverb (with a 15" speaker), and a Peavey Delta Blues (30 watts with a 15" Blue Marvel). All of them cost under $500. Head cabinets cost $200 new, and you can find some used for less. I bring along the smallest one of these amps that can handle the venue. Someday (when I get my credit card paid down a little more) I'd like to get a little Vibrolux and put a 12" neodymium speaker in it for some acoustic practices and jams I participate in.

A lot of steelers find the solid sate amps to be okay for them. I've never tried a Webb, and maybe they sound more tube-like than the other solid states. I think the ss amps work for lots of people who use them at moderate volume, and mic them if they need more volume. But for me, I prefer the tube sound at any volume.

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 25 Oct 2004 7:38 am

The power/hernia ratio of tube amps is just too low for me. There are some SS amps that sound better to me than others, but you can get much more power out of a pound of transistor amp than out of a valve amp. My personal favorites are:

They're all old and no longer mfgd except for the last one:
* Standel solid state amps, preferably the Custom series, from 1970 or earlier.
* Peavey's original steel amps, the Session 400 and LTD 400
* The Nashville 112 (primarily for smaller gigs, included because it is a great sounding small amp)

Well . . . you asked

I do like the sound of a tube circuit for steel. There's a warm fuzzy sound that a tube can create that's hard to duplicate with a solid state circuit. I have found that using Brad Sarno's Black Box as the first device in the chain gives a good solid state amp some of that tube character without weighing it down so badly.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 25 October 2004 at 08:39 AM.]

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 25 Oct 2004 5:43 pm

There's a warm fuzzy sound that a tube can create that's hard to duplicate with a solid state circuit.

Hopefully not too fuzzy!

Seriously, there are good and bad tube amps, and there are good and bad solid state amps. My favorite amps are all tubes, though. You can always mike it if you need more volume. A good 40 watt tube amp is about all I really need.

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/Hotb0b.gif" width="96 height="96">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra SD-12 (Ext E9), Williams D-12 Crossover, Sierra S-12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop 8 (E6add9), Fender Stringmaster (E13, C6, A6)