Drum Machine Suggestions

Dave Birkett · Post by **Dave Birkett** » 13 Apr 2002 11:01 am

I'm looking for a drum machine that has good country beats, shuffles, and jazz swing. I'm not interested in Hip Hop and other Disco rhythms. Any suggestions? Thanks.
Dave Birkett

ajm · Post by **ajm** » 13 Apr 2002 12:57 pm

Are you going to use it for recording?

I recently bought a drum machine to do some recording/writing with. I kind of do things the long way sometimes, but my writing process is this:
a) I get an idea for a song and kind of work out the basic riff.
b) I go through all of the preset patterns on the drum machine one by one and note down which ones have a possibility of working.
c) I copy them to the "user" pattern section of the drum machine. I then string about 4 copies of each pattern together one after another into a "song".
d) I then play that "song" in the drum machine while playing the basic riff over and over on the guitar, recording both.
e) Then I go back over the whole thing and listen while taking notes. "This pattern will work, this one needs to change here, I need to add the cowbell here, this one ain't got a chance, etc.")

All of that said, I bought essentially the least expensive machine on the market, a Zoom 123. I wanted a machine to sync up with the recorder, which it does (this is important). The sounds are fairly good, but you can't change the pitch of the snares, etc. There is a fairly wide variety though. It also does bass lines, which is something that I haven't used.

I like country (Buck, etc.) but I also like the 70s-80s hard rock stuff (ZZ Top, Van Halen, Stevie Ray, etc.). There is a fair selection of different kits and sounds, but it seems as though there are very few actual straight drum sets without the reverbs, etc. I do like the 80s BIG Def Leppard drum sounds, just not on Tiger by the Tail

And there are no shortage of hip hop rap techno sounds. The few country patterns that they give you are not very impressive. There are about 300 preset uneditable patterns and about 100 user programmable slots. I wish that they would get rid of about 100-150 of the preset hipraphop slots and give you a few more user slots. In other words, just give you a DRUM machine.

I also wish that there were some way to back up the patterns to an external device like a cassette or something. I did not want to buy all kinds of extra stuff to do my projects with, just a drum machine and the studio. I try to limit myself to 10 patterns per song, which gives some variety but also keeps the whole process under control. With only 100 user slots, it's starting to fill up pretty quickly.

With a cable to sync up to the recorder and a cable to record the audio with, it was less than $200 out the door. I had considered an Alesis SR-16, but couldn't find one and besides, they're not making them any more. If I would have wanted to spend a little more, one of the Roland/Boss machines would be a little better. I think some of them have 200 user slots.

I have a gut feel that no matter which machine you buy, you're going to have to do some editing of patterns. Either to add a roll, change the hi hat to a ride cymbal, etc.

All in all the Zoom is pretty good, and if this is your first experience into home recording you're going to be blowing your mind for a long time to come. The power that they are packing into little boxes these days is astounding.

Ron Randall · Post by **Ron Randall** » 13 Apr 2002 1:55 pm

I have a Boss Rhythm Dr 770.
It has tons of capability, but...
the preset country stuff is very limited. It will self record any drum riff you can play on it.

It is midi capable which is great for recording ease.

Unless you want to create your own drum track/programs for country I would not recommend it.

Matt Steindl · Post by **Matt Steindl** » 13 Apr 2002 3:28 pm

I second the ZOOM suggestion. I have the 234, and it has been great! You can also program a bass line, and the sampled drum and bass tones are super real(cymbols excepted). Dont worry about the lack of country beats, just tweak the rock ones and change the drum kits on the hip hop/rap/disco ones! Good Luck!!!

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Mattman in "The Big Sleazy"-:
S-10 Dekley, Suitcase Fender Rhodes, B-bender Les Paul

erik · Post by **erik** » 13 Apr 2002 3:35 pm

I have a ZOOM PS-02 recorder which is responsible for my latest wave of songwriting inspiration. So, with that in mind, i would check out their top drum machine the 323. It has better quality sounds then any of their other drum machines. It also has bass patterns. The PS-02 derives it's sounds from the 323. I can't say if they will have many preset patterns to strick your fancy, though. I have owned many drum machines. The Rolands are great, i'm just tired of their sound.

Dave Birkett · Post by **Dave Birkett** » 13 Apr 2002 4:05 pm

Thanks for your replys. The reason I'm searching for swing and shuffles is that they are difficult to program in a way that sounds human. I have a drum program in my Cakewalk recording software. It's a midi program and the patterns were made recording an actual human being but the choices are minimal. Drum patterns based on straight eighths or quarters are easy. It's when you want to "swing" them that it becomes problematic. Since in today's music there is no swing, drum machines, at least the one's I've tried in the stores, don't need to be designed to do so. Has anyone found some particularly good percentage levels for quantizing swing or shuffles?

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 13 Apr 2002 4:22 pm

I don't know if you are into computers or not but have you ever looked at Band-in-a-Box or Jammer? I use BIAB quite extensively but understand that Jammer has better drum tracks with unlimited morphing.

erik · Post by **erik** » 14 Apr 2002 3:38 am

Dave,
So much of electronic House music relies on swing patterns. The original Linn drum machine all the way up to today's new Akai MPC 4000 have adjustable swing 8ths and 16ths. The old Roland TR series have swing built into them. The current Boss machines, 660, 770, 670 have swing in them. The ZOOM 323 has swing in it(i think). Many keyboard sequencers have swing in them. For electronic music I adjust swing percentage in accordance with tempo. The other important feature found on many newer sequencers is a humanize function that alters gates and volume. Swing adjustment in itself is not very authentic. Keep in mind that most drum machines quantize on 96ppq, whereas most software sequencers have a minimum of 384ppq.

erik · Post by **erik** » 14 Apr 2002 3:47 am

Dave,
Have you looked at one of these?
http://yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/Specs/?gSEQ00005QY100

ROBERT MYERS · Post by **ROBERT MYERS** » 14 Apr 2002 4:38 am

Dave, The best thing I've found is the Boss DR5 with a program that Billy Cooper put in it. You have Bass, Drums and Rythmn and with his program in it you can write any song you want.

coopersmusic@hotmail.com

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Bob Myers Derby S10 3&4

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 14 Apr 2002 9:37 am

i've got a Boss DR660.
it's more than complete.
you can compose your beats or patterns.
Steel beatin'...

Fred Murphy · Post by **Fred Murphy** » 14 Apr 2002 6:26 pm

I would have to recommend the SR16, and it is still available around Indianpolis. All of the stores I went to had them in the last couple of weeks anyway. As far as country patterns are concerned, I don't think any drum maker sells one that has good country patterns. You have to make them yourself, but that isn't too hard to make about anything you need. If you were an actual drummer yourself, it would be easy, but you can listen to records and come pretty close. On the SR-16 it is Midi capable, and you can also store everything to a simple cassete. It will hold ten or more complete preprogrammed songs, depending on how complicated you make it, and if you will use it with a good PA amp, with 15" speakers, it will sound pretty real. Also you can swing the beat anywhere you want in the programming, if that is what you want to do. The only drawback I find with this machine is the lack of good brushes, but I haven't heard good ones on any other kind either. Also there is a program you can buy that doesn't cost very much, that you can put in your computer to program the SR-16, if you are more comfortable using the computer.

gary darr · Post by **gary darr** » 14 Apr 2002 7:21 pm

I'm with Fred on this one,I use my SR-16 to record and gig with,like most you have to program your country beats.....the factory ones are pretty cheesy

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Sho-Bud proII custom,Session 500,American standard Strat,Shecter tele,Peavy Classic 50,Fender Vibrolux

Bob Bowden · Post by **Bob Bowden** » 14 Apr 2002 7:32 pm

SR-16 for me also. If you chain patterns together to make a song instead of recording the song in it's entirety, less memory is used and up to 100 songs can be programmed in. The machine also has 233 drum sounds so if you dont like the supplied kits, you can make up your own.

erik · Post by **erik** » 15 Apr 2002 3:01 am

AFAIK, the Alesis does not have a swing adjustment parameter.

Robert Parent · Post by **Robert Parent** » 15 Apr 2002 3:58 am

A Roland DR-770 is a great drum box. Like most machines it's geared at the non-country market but there are some very good sounds buried inside. Just ignore the names and use what sounds good! Alesis SR-16 is a good machine as well but the sounds are very dated.

Fred Murphy · Post by **Fred Murphy** » 15 Apr 2002 6:48 am

Erik, if you will select (record setup) then scroll up you will find the (swing select) function.