A6 on a square neck resonator

[Stephen Baker]

I recently picked up my first resonator, a square neck with a spider. It was, almost, in standard guitar tuning when I got it, go figure, so I just dropped the 6, 5 & 1st down a tone for an open G thing. That sounded ok for bluesy licks but that’s not really me. I’m more 40’s/50’s country, western swing, rockabilly etc. All of my other steels have a tuning with a 6th in there. I was thinking of tuning it to A6 (R,3,5,6,R,3 low to high). That’s what I’d usually use on this scale length, 25”. Have any of you guys done this? Also, any advice on strings? Bronze? Nickel? TIA.

[Noah Miller]

I use the next inversion up, with C# on the bottom and E on top - both on tricone and spider bridge. I even used it for a while on slide guitar. Works just fine, if you use the right string gauges. I'd probably start with bronze but try monel, nickel, anything. Not everyone may agree with me but I find resonators are less picky about winding types than ordinary acoustic guitars.

[Eric Dahlhoff]

I've tried A6 (1,3,5,6,1,3) on my reso a couple times but never bonded with it. Too high, no bottom.
Noah, the 3,5,6,1,3,5 interests me. What gauge are you starting with on the low C#?
Thanks for the idea!

[Noah Miller]

I use 38-32-28-23w-17-14 for C#-E-F#-A-C#-E. I started with the SIT A6 string set, which I use on electric steels, and modified it slightly for more even tension and a firmer low string to help keep the bar level.

[Eric Dahlhoff]

Thanks Noah.
I was assuming you were starting an octave lower on the C#.
A whole different tonal range.
I'll give it a try.

[Stephen Baker]

I use the next inversion up, with C# on the bottom and E on top

Thanks Noah, I can’t believe I didn’t think of that for myself. This was the tuning I was given, though in C, that opened up the lap steel up to the licks I was looking to emulate 30 years ago. Plus, with a few tweaks I get good old C6. I think that’s the way to go.

[Paul Seager]

A6 is my goto tuning on electric 8 string but I've struggled to find a solution on a 6 string resonator. I prefer a 5 on top and the 6 on string 4, so top down;
E, C#, A, F#.

On my Tricone I currently have another E at string 5 and the root A on string 6. This gives a stronger comping chord when jamming with say guitar and bass but messes with my usual solo style because ideally I'd like a C# on string 6! I've tried that but then one pretty much loses the ability to function as a rhythm instrument - no low-end at all.

I dabble in bluegrass and have been adapting to open G. I now appreciate that I can provide a bigger rhythm sound without a 6 in the tuning and dropping the low G down to E for minor-key songs isn't so hard to get used to.

I've resigned myself, that if I want a six-string A tuning with a 5 on top then I must use open A.

My advice therefore is to consider the role the tuning will play in an ensemble.

[John Chadwick]

This a very informative thread, but I have a very newbie question. Please excuse my ignorance on the subject, but here goes.

I use A6 tuning on my eight-string lap steel, and I use major tunings like Open D or Open G on my square-neck resonator.
I would like to break out occasionally and try some different tunings for the reso, but I thought that the use of light gauge strings, like the gauges shown above, (38-32-28-23w-17-14) to get a sixth tuning on a reso ----- would be a "no-no."

I thought that you need to use heavier strings like EJ42s to drive the cone and get good tone.

I swear I have read this on a million different sites. Is that not true?

Can someone clarify?

I like the sound of high-bass A tuning for example, but would never try to tune up that high with EJ42. I do use capo, but not altogether happy with how it sounds.

Thank you.

[Brooks Montgomery]

If was me, I would use Cindy Cashdollar’s G6 dobro tuning (low to high) GBEGBD , regular dobro strings.

And capo 2 when A6 is wanted.

[Lee Rider]

I have my 6 string dobro set up with a Hipshot Doubleshot or it is easy to tune strings 1-3 down:

Regular G dobro tuning with it engaged: GBDGBD

G11 with the lever up: GBDFAC

[Erv Niehaus]

On a 6 string guitar I just stick to a plain major tuning, no 6ths.

[Gary Meixner]

Paul,

Every so often I will set up my spider style reso to play in either A6 or G6 tuning. Usually it is because I am going to be playin in an acoustic setting and plugging in would be considered bad form. I seem to get sick of it pretty quick and change back to either A major high bass or A major low bass.

It may be my guitar, or how I play, but regardless of where in the string order I put the 6th tone it doesnt seem sound right to my ears on a reso: it is of course, the meat and potatos on my standard 6 or 8 string electric guitars. I feel my reso sounds best with simple major triads or some variation of root, third, fifth. I think the closer interval created by the 6th tone doesnt carry the impact like it does on an electric. Plus I really like taking a break from playing 6th based tunings.

There are players who can make the tuning sing on a reso, and in fact the first person who I saw play a reso live was using a G6 tuning. It blew my mind, and is a big reason why I took up playing lap style guitars. That was a lifetime ago. Most of my playing these days is 6 string electric steel in C6 (C13, C6/A7) C#m, and B11, or A major hgh bass and occasionly C#m on reso. I will often take tunes that I would normally play in C6 on the electric and re-arrange them for A maj on the reso. Its a totally diffrent sound but at times can be very effective and quite beautiful.

Gary Meixner

[Paul Seager]

It may be my guitar, or how I play, but regardless of where in the string order I put the 6th tone it doesnt seem sound right to my ears on a reso: it is of course, the meat and potatos on my standard 6 or 8 string electric guitars. I feel my reso sounds best with simple major triads or some variation of root, third, fifth. I think the closer interval created by the 6th tone doesnt carry the impact like it does on an electric. Plus I really like taking a break from playing 6th based tunings.

Exactly!

[Stephen Cowell]

It may be my guitar, or how I play, but regardless of where in the string order I put the 6th tone it doesnt seem sound right to my ears on a reso: it is of course, the meat and potatos on my standard 6 or 8 string electric guitars. I feel my reso sounds best with simple major triads or some variation of root, third, fifth. I think the closer interval created by the 6th tone doesnt carry the impact like it does on an electric. Plus I really like taking a break from playing 6th based tunings.

Exactly!

You'd hate my E13 8-string then!

https://youtube.com/shorts/PrUIeXyK3uQ? ... 8NB5EivMDs

I guess the 6 is hidden in the general mess. 6-bombs really stand out (and not in a good way) at bluegrass jams I must agree... that's when the Beard Vintage R comes out. This guitar is for western swing at picker's circles.

[Gary Meixner]

Stephen,
Yowza! That guitar with that tuning was made to swing.!

G. Meixner

[Gregory LeBlanc]

I had some fun playing around with low to high G6 tuning of BDEGBD. It definitely works best in a group, but seems like that's your plan.

I also like that it's just a standard string pack + a single.

[Mark Eaton]

If was me, I would use Cindy Cashdollar’s G6 dobro tuning (low to high) GBEGBD , regular dobro strings.

And capo 2 when A6 is wanted.

I'm with Brooks on this. And "buyer beware," you need to change out the 4th string in a standard G dobro set from the typical .036w to at least .034w or even .032w to be on the safe side. No way can you tune up to E from D with a 36 gauge 4th string on a typical dobro with a 25" scale - it'll blow every time. I've even broken .034w strings tuning up to E from D on the 4th string.

IMO G (along with D) based tunings on a resonator are still the best solution for tone, the heavy strings "load" the resonator cone and you get the phat bass on the lower strings. And as Brooks mentioned a capo at two gets you a version of A6. A quality capo like Charlie's Slide Pro does a good job of what I refer to as "limiting tone death."

There used to be an occasional jam in my general neck of the woods, coincidentally in the "metropolis" of Cloverdale, home of The Steel Guitar Forum. A couple times I got to play a seven string resonator built by Todd Clinesmith, when he was still building resos. The owner tuned it to G6: low to high GBDEGBD. I fell in love with that guitar - didn't want to give it back to him. It was really fun to play. Having the full Open G tuning with the E added in the middle - it struck me as being easier to avoid those "6-bombs" as mentioned by Stephen Cowell.

The only bummer about seven and eight string resos is if you're playing out in a mixed acoustic/electric scenario where it gets loud and a microphone may not cut it - there is no good pickup available. But there is one in the works at Beard. I emailed Denny at Beard in August, because some time ago Paul Beard shared in a social media video that they are working on seven and eight string pickups. Denny replied to my email and wrote that they have these in the works with production planned but no delivery date set. I asked him if there is light at the end of the tunnel and he replied, "there is light at the end of the tunnel, but it is still quite dim."

[Stephen Cowell]

The only bummer about seven and eight string resos is if you're playing out in a mixed acoustic/electric scenario where it gets loud and a microphone may not cut it - there is no good pickup available. But there is one in the works at Beard. I emailed Denny at Beard in August, because some time ago Paul Beard shared in a social media video that they are working on seven and eight string pickups. Denny replied to my email and wrote that they have these in the works with production planned but no delivery date set. I asked him if there is light at the end of the tunnel and he replied, "there is light at the end of the tunnel, but it is still quite dim."

Yes, such a pickup would be near and dear to me... Howard Parker owns the only extant one I believe, and it was a real PITA to make I hear. I've been in contact with Gabby at Beard and she said she'd let me know... of course, it's been years now since Howard's was made.

I got fed up and ordered a bunch of piezos from CB Gitty:
https://www.cbgitty.com/guitar-instrume ... g-options/

I bought a 10-pack of 6-string... probably should have bought 4's, but supposedly you can cut them. Looking at all photos of the Fishman I can find, it seems that you have to groove the bridge piece and epoxy the pickup in there. You want the pieces loaded, so you'd want to clamp the thing together when setting the glue... and you don't want the glue getting in the contacts, there's a copper strip that runs across the top for the tip conductor. Pretty sure I'd take the heat-shrink off, that looks like what Fishman did.

For my PBS 8 it has a two-piece bridge, you should be able to use two 4's... the Benoit has an offset spider with a single piece of wood. I'll probably try doing this to a Regal I have in pieces before messing with my more expensive guitars. The Benoit has one of those donut pickups but it sounds like hell, my Vintage R with the Fishman sounds wonderful.

[Tim Toberer]

The only bummer about seven and eight string resos is if you're playing out in a mixed acoustic/electric scenario where it gets loud and a microphone may not cut it - there is no good pickup available. But there is one in the works at Beard. I emailed Denny at Beard in August, because some time ago Paul Beard shared in a social media video that they are working on seven and eight string pickups. Denny replied to my email and wrote that they have these in the works with production planned but no delivery date set. I asked him if there is light at the end of the tunnel and he replied, "there is light at the end of the tunnel, but it is still quite dim."

I have been experimenting with blending piezo and a hum bucker on my standard acoustic guitar and I like it quite a lot. I like its so much I'm converting several of my other acoustics including a lap steel. Lots of subtle variations between the 2, or I can have a straight electric sound with the volume all the way up on the guitar. This pretty much overwhelms the piezo.

It is pretty simple on a round hole instrument, but could be done on a reso obviously. I am using disc piezos. I wire the hum bucker to volume on the instrument and run that to the tip of a stereo jack, then the piezo is wired directly to the ring. As you turn down the volume on the guitar, more piezo sound is blended in. I also built a little pedalboard that splits the signal and runs the mag pickup through a couple pedals and the acoustic through a preamp pedal. Both of these go into a stereo looper. I run them to separate amps, but I can also pug directly into my stereo amp.

[Brooks Montgomery]

Mark E. , thanks for the save on changing out the #4 string for 6-string dobro string sets for G6 tuning. I had forgotten that important tidbit, and do remember the sound of the “pop” when #4 broke on me. That Clinesmith 7-string sounds cool (as does anything Todd builds).

Stephen C. & Tim T. , you guys are onto it, I’ll bet there some great sounding DIY electrifying possibilities. The coolest “commercial” set up that I’ve seen so far is Paul Beard’s Road-a-phonic 6-string lap/dobro hybrid (which I received a few months back). .It has a Fishman Nashville bridge pickup, a Lollar gold foil, and a Lollar P-90 . They can be played individually, or blended, with seamless great sounding results (and can be signal split also). Unplugged, the small cone, alone, is adequate for practicing, but won’t cut it in an acoustic circle.

I got the Hipshot Doubleshot on mine, and being able to go from G to D “dobro tuning” so easily makes one fantasize……”now if Beard could do this as a 7-string, and Hipshot could add one more string….”

[Gary Meixner]

On the sunject of pickups, have any of you looked at the Myers Pickups? They are not really a pickup but a good quality flexible microphone. I bought one a few months ago and like it very much. They sound fantastic and have good feedback rejection. Seem to work well in most environments. It may not be ideal if you have to compete with a full on electric band with loud guitars and a tasteless drummer. I have had great luck using it in acoustic, and acoustic / electric outings. It seems to have good isolation and doesnt pick up other instruments on stage.

They have a variety of mounting options so you can position the microphone in a spot for optimum tone and convience. No more trying to hug an SM57 on a stand. During performances I switch back and forth between electric steel and resonator and find it to be a great solution.

It has its own pre-amp and volume control. I dont bother with an extra pre-amp as long as I am plugging into the microphone input on the PA. If using a guitar amp or similar you will most likely need a pre-amp.

If you are looking to make a single guitar that can be used in both acoustic and electric environments, then a piezo paired with a megnetic pickup might be a better choice, although I have had a hard time getting volume and tone out of a piezo that has a good acoustic sound and doesn't feedback. The Fishman set up, with JD preamp is probably fantastic, but I wanted one pickup that I could easily use on a variety of guitars and Myers does that.

G. Meixner

[Bill Leff]

Which Myers pickup are you using? I’m currently experimenting with a Krivo magnetic pickup with my Recording King squareneck plugging directly into my Quilter combo amp.

[Gary Meixner]

Bill,

My interest in the Myers was to find a pickup that would be convenient to use, provide good volume with better than typical feedback rejection on difficult stages, while preserving the acoustic sound of my instrument. I didn't want to alter the instrument, and it needed to be affordable and not require additional special processors, pedals, etc. I play mostly Hawaiian music and country blues on my Tricone (and homemade reso), and don't want to sound like a guy with an electric slide guitar. I have other instruments for that.

The pickup or micro phone is the same throughout, I chose the Grip series with a 6" goosneck. This version you can mount the preamp with volume control on the top of the guitar, putting it within easy reach. The suction cup works well on most smooth, glossy surafces and can be easily removed without damaging the finsih.

You can take the suction cup off and use 3M Command Strips as well. The Command strips don't seem to harm the finsh and can be easily removed, although I would still be cautious on a precious custom instrument. Myers has a new mounting system called The Quickmount which clamps onto the top and back of the guitar. I ordered one for my Tricone. I dont have it yet but will be happy to report once I do.

Myers sells a very light weight and flexible patch cord that is a good accessory. It doesnt put a lot of extra weight on the pre amp mounting and helps it stay put.

The whole mounting aspect is not 100% trouble free, but I would say the mounting systems that they offer are very good, well thought out, and more or less plug and play: I think a clever tech could devise a way to make a more permanent mounting for hard stage use. The Quickmount might be the best solution of all - more to follow on this subject.

As far as my original requirements: the sound quality is exceptional, with excellent feedback rejection and it beats trying play into a microphone on a stand all night. If you are going into a PA mic input, no additional processing is nessecary except maybe DI. If you are an acrobatic performer it may not be ideal, a magnetic pickup might be best.

I looked at the Krivo and thought they sounded pretty good on standard Tricone payed with a bottleneck, and for blues might be the thing to have, unless you want the true, natural acoustic sound of your instrument.

I would think for Bluegrass the Myers would be an excellent choice as an afforable alternative to the Fishman, or in addition. It is not super expensive, around the same cost as a quality microphone.

In your case give the Krivo a try and if you are not happy try the Myers. They are good folks and really want to help.

Best regard,

Gary