Will a 12" speaker improve my setup?

[Paul Douglas]

I'd like to improve the quality of my sound and I'm looking at getting a better speaker as a starting point. I'm fairly new to lap steel and was not a guitar player before so I don't have much experience of equipment. I bought a Behringer HA-20R as a cheap way to get started and to be fair it does a pretty good job for the money, but it doesn't sound fantastic, and I'm thinking of buying an external speaker cab and using it with the Behringer amp (which I can replace with a better head unit at some later stage).

Whatever I buy will have to come from Thomann. I have no chance of trying anything anywhere so it will be a matter of choosing something and then living with it, but I'm assuming that a decent quality speaker will be better than the 8" Bugera that the Behringer comes with. It will never leave the house and I don't want lots of volume. Thomann sell a 12" Celestion that gets great reviews https://www.thomann.de/ie/harley_benton ... intage.htm

So, I have 2 questions really. Firstly, will getting an external speaker like this sound better? I know "better" is subjective but I mean in the way that a Mercedes will always be better than a Trabant.

Second question is: is this particular speaker just too big? I'll be using it in a small room (20 cubic metres), mostly at low volume levels. I don't know enough about speakers to know if it will be operating in such a way that it never really "gets going" - maybe I need something smaller that would produce less sound and get driven a bit harder? In which case, suggestions for size etc would be welcome. I'm looking for something that is mounted in a cab, sounds warm yet clear, is a distinct improvement on what I've got, and is available from Thomann.

Thank you.

[Tim Whitlock]

A better speaker may help, but honestly I think you would be amazed at the difference a good quality amp will make. Any used Fender Princetons or Vibrochamps in your area? Sorry, but IMHO, I wouldn't waste a lot of time trying to chase down great tone from that particular amp.

[Paul Douglas]

Tim: thank you. Doesn't really surprise me that you said that. Sadly there is really nothing around here so anything I bought would have to be new or used via Reverb. There are lots of amps on Reverb but only 2 or 3 Vibrochamps under €1000, mostly they're over, and Princetons are more expensive. That's really beyond my budget, and it's quite a lot to spend on something used that I can't try out in advance.

[Tim Toberer]

This is the last piece of gear I bought and I wish it was the first. https://www.thomann.de/ie/harley_benton ... uetone.htm

I wouldn't bother with that extension speaker. This little pedal does a very convincing job of turning any amp into a Fender. The cleans are pretty unbelievable. It also does a nice edge of breakup sound and cleans up with the volume knob. For $30 you can't go wrong. There are some good threads on how to use it for steel guitar. It is also very versatile for performance or recording cause you can use it as an "ampless" rig. I use it with headphones for silent practice through my interface, but I think you can use a signal splitter and plug headphones right into the pedal.

[Paul Douglas]

Thanks for the suggestion. The box is certainly cheap at €30 and I've got that much credit with Thomann at the moment so it would be sort-of free. However, it's a bit hard to believe that I could either spend €1000+ on a real Fender amp or just use this €30 box with what I've got. Doesn't that at least assume that the amp it will go with is of the "straight wire with gain" type, so Fender-like sounds go in and Fender-like sounds come out? I think it's more likely that Behringer-like sounds will come out!

[Stew Crookes]

Based on the specs, that should be a very nice cabinet (Vintage 30, plywood construction) and it'll probably sound better than the Behringer speaker just based on the quality of a V30, rather than being 12" vs 8" speakers...
Whether it would be worth the upgrade without a better amp, and in the low volume scenario you describe is kind of anyone's guess. The limiting factor in your amp's tone might be the amp itself, might be the speaker... hard to say really.

Thomann has a 30 day no hassle return policy so you'd only be risking return shipping if you get it and find that it doesn't make enough difference to justify keeping it - just sayin'

[Tim Toberer]

Thanks for the suggestion. The box is certainly cheap at €30 and I've got that much credit with Thomann at the moment so it would be sort-of free. However, it's a bit hard to believe that I could either spend €1000+ on a real Fender amp or just use this €30 box with what I've got. Doesn't that at least assume that the amp it will go with is of the "straight wire with gain" type, so Fender-like sounds go in and Fender-like sounds come out? I think it's more likely that Behringer-like sounds will come out!

I wouldn't over think it. It is a cheap pedal that will improve your sound. There are better preamp pedals I am sure, but none come close to this for the price. I had the Quilter Superblock ($299) and I like the American Sound much better. It has better cleans and more gain, also I didn't need the power amp, XLR or effects loop. You will still be limited by the 20 watts and 8" speaker. Neither of these are good ingredients for the steel guitar, but for practice it is plenty.

Set the EQ on the Behringer as flat as possible, usually this is by putting all the knobs at 12 o'clock. Sometimes on these small amps the best clean sound is on the drive channel with the gain set low, you might want to try that. Now plug in the pedal and think of the Behringer as just a power amp. If the Behringer had an effects loop, you can run the pedal into that and it bypasses the preamp, but I don't think this one does. It is nice that it has reverb at least.

I am still learning how to use the American Sound pedal, but the controls are very interactive. The more gain you use, the less the Voice knob affects the sound. With the gain set fairly low and the Voice to the left, you get a pretty convincing Fender Mid scoop sound. The more you turn the Voice to the right, the more it sounds like an earlier model Fender tweed. The pedal is modeled after a Tweed Bassman amp which is nothing like your amp, but this pedal is very good. The 3 band EQ is also interactive. Best to start with them all the way up then reduce each to taste. Most of the volume is in the Middle control I'm finding. Good luck and have fun!

[Paul Douglas]

Tim: thanks for all the advice - I will try it out!

[Jim Pollard]

Seems like having the external cabinet will always open the option to experiment. Hell if you're handy you can even build a cabinet. I've literally done this with scrap wood I found on my street and then put a Warehouse speaker in it. For that fender-ish thing if you can get your hands on one I really love a Quilter US SuperBlock. https://reverb.com/item/51546097-quilte ... p-25-watts

[Tim Toberer]

Tim: thanks for all the advice - I will try it out!

Anytime! I am still a beginner with this stuff, but I have learned from some expensive "mistakes" when it comes to gear. This stuff is fun, but it can also be expensive and frustrating. For beginners it doesn't make much sense to spend a ton of money and time on amps and effects. I have wasted enough of both on this and finally think I have the stuff I need to move forward. Once I get a few more pedals He he he he

[Paul Douglas]

...finally think I have the stuff I need to move forward. Once I get a few more pedals He he he he

[Chris Templeton]

For a gig, if there's a mixer, often, one's amp mostly serves as a personal monitor and mixers don't want an instrument's level competing with their mix.
If there's no mixer 12's can improve things.
For my Tapper, I used a Fender DeVille that had 4 10s.

[Phillip Hermans]

Thomann carries this amp as well which could pair nicely with a 12" cab: https://www.thomann.de/ie/quilter_superblock_us.htm

[Paul Douglas]

But, it makes the choices even more complicated!