PREAMP TUBE RACK FOR PSG

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi guys I would like to make a stereo rig to use with my PSG in big live shows, I'm looking on the internet for a 1 rack unit tube preamp with two channels 1 cluean and 1 drive, with send and Return R/L outputs to connect stereo effects, the Mesa Boogie Studio preamp is a great pre but it's too bulky, heavy and I don't have the possibility of having two channels with separate controls, if anyone has tried tube preamps perfect for the 2-channel 1 rack unit PSG if you want to share your experiences I would thank you very much. Greetings Frank

[Dave Stagner]

Would it be possible to just use a drive pedal with a single channel rack preamp? I've dealt with single channel amps that way for years for regular guitar. Gives a lot more flexibility - just get a clean channel you really like, and a drive pedal (or two, or four) that work well with that clean channel.

[Rich Ertelt]

There is very little being made these days for rack stuff for guitar. Especially in tubes.
This, Maybe -
https://www.synergyamps.com/shop/hardware/syn2/
I don't know anything about them other than I've heard of them.

I just did a session, I used a Sarno Classic tube pre, and I used a Kingsley Harlot, which is a tube OD pedal. Sounded great. I used the OD both for one steel song and one slide song. The pedal has only a treble roll off, but does have multi position switches for bass and treble settings. It is my primary pedal for guitar gigs and sounds great.

Take the mono out of the Sarno, into a stereo FX, into a stereo power amp. That is what I would do if I wanted stereo.

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Rich, thank you for answering me, I had seen the Synery but only the empty box without the 2 preamps costs $1000 in Italy and then $400 dollars each preamp, I don't think it's worth throwing away all these sounds to have a good clean sound and a drive channel that I only use in one song, I found some 1 unit rack tube preamps, but I don't know if with the PSG it can respond well in the clean part. That's why I posted here in the forum if maybe someone had tried a 1 unit rack preamp that was good for the steel. Good music Frank

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Dave thanks for writing me your comment, actually I'm looking for a 1U rack tube preamp that can be good for my stereo rig that I would like to do for my big Dire Straits live with the great band I collaborate with. Good music Frank

[Dave Grafe]

Fitting tubes and the transformer to drive them into a single rack unit and them stuffing that into a small rack with other gear is a recipe for thermal failure even if it could be done. IMHO what you are looking for is best accomplished with either Brad Sarno's Revelation Preamp or the Walker Stereo Steel preamp, both legendary for their great tube sound and comprehensive steel-oriented feature set, and both regularly available here on the forum.

Another option would be a modern solid-state preamp with a Sarno Steel Guitar Black Box between guitar and VP. The variable impedance of the Black Box and the direct connection between the guitar's pickup and the tube's control grid is absolutely stellar, a feature also present in the Revelation Pre.

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Dave thanks a lot for your great advice, yes I have a Sarno Black Box that I use after the steel and then I go to the volume pedal and from the volume pedal to the solid head and I have a perfect mono sound. I'll see what I can find on the internet of preamps where the back has the stereo fx loop outputs to connect the stereo effects. Thanks a lot Francesco

[Dave Grafe]

Hi Dave thanks a lot for your great advice, yes I have a Sarno Black Box that I use after the steel and then I go to the volume pedal and from the volume pedal to the solid head and I have a perfect mono sound. I'll see what I can find on the internet of preamps where the back has the stereo fx loop outputs to connect the stereo effects. Thanks a lot Francesco

Again, the Revelation Preamp AND Stereo Steel both have stereo effects loop returns and main outputs from a mono input.

[Dave Grafe]

Sarno Revelation Preamp, you can also find them with transformer isolated XLR outputs

[Francesco Porcu]

It would be great to find a Sarno Revelation in Europe but it will be difficult to find it. But I will try to look for it, thanks for the photos you posted very useful I think for many users who would like to make a stereo rig.

[Bas Kapitein]

There is actualy a preamp built in Holland specially for the pedal steel. I will be posting some information about it very soon but you can already have the info if you send me a PM

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Bas thanks for your reply but I already have a mono tube preamp, if you read my post carefully I am looking for a 1U rack unit preamp to make a stereo rig with the rear Send - Return L Return R outputs to be able to connect the stereo effects in parallel, and the two OUT outputs where I connect the two Dv Mark Little GH 250 heads. For now I use only one head with an Effectrode Black Bird tube preamp and it works great. Francesco

[Rich Ertelt]

Hi Rich, thank you for answering me, I had seen the Synery but only the empty box without the 2 preamps costs $1000 in Italy and then $400 dollars each preamp, I don't think it's worth throwing away all these sounds to have a good clean sound and a drive channel that I only use in one song, I found some 1 unit rack tube preamps, but I don't know if with the PSG it can respond well in the clean part. That's why I posted here in the forum if maybe someone had tried a 1 unit rack preamp that was good for the steel. Good music Frank

You are going to be really limited trying to find a Rack unit, that has both a clean and OD channel, And a stereo return, And is tube. And it certainly won't be cheap. The Sarno is probably the only one I can think of that is tube and has a stereo return, and it is single channel.

Not sure why you would need a stereo loop. The FX come back in as stereo and then right out again, they would be the last thing in the chain, unless the pre puts reverb post loop, and even then, I prefer the reverb in outboard over the one in my Sarno.. Use the preamp you have (I have a Sarno SMS, which is a single channel tube pre, mono out, that is designed for steel). I can get stereo by going from the out of that to the FX mono it, to the stereo out to a stereo power amp and then 2 speakers.

What are you using for stereo FX? There isn't much in the rack mounted FX units being made anymore.

And since you only need OD for one song, get a pedal, put it before the volume pedal. I just recorded a couple songs like that, it sounded great, client was happy. And you say you have the Blackbird, doesn't it have a clean channel and an OD channel? Is that not working for you? I had one for a while and thought it sounded pretty good.

Back in the late 80s, early 90s, rack stuff was big for guitar players. That era is gone and there is not very much made for that market in a long time. There maybe something like you are talking about out there, but if $1000 is too much, I don't know what you will find. I know, I've looked. But, good luck on your search, you may find someone out there making something like that. If you do, share, as I don't think most people would be aware of it.

You would need a stereo power amp anyway, there is

[Rich Ertelt]

Hi Rich, thank you for answering me, I had seen the Synery but only the empty box without the 2 preamps costs $1000 in Italy and then $400 dollars each preamp, I don't think it's worth throwing away all these sounds to have a good clean sound and a drive channel that I only use in one song, I found some 1 unit rack tube preamps, but I don't know if with the PSG it can respond well in the clean part. That's why I posted here in the forum if maybe someone had tried a 1 unit rack preamp that was good for the steel. Good music Frank

You are going to be really limited trying to find a Rack unit, that has both a clean and OD channel, And a stereo return, And is tube. And it certainly won't be cheap. The Sarno is probably the only one I can think of that is tube and has a stereo return, and it is single channel.

Not sure why you would need a stereo loop. The FX come back in as stereo and then right out again, they would be the last thing in the chain, unless the pre puts reverb post loop, and even then, I prefer the reverb in outboard over the one in my Sarno.. Use the preamp you have (I have a Sarno SMS, which is a single channel tube pre, mono out, that is designed for steel). I can get stereo by going from the out of that to the FX mono it, to the stereo out to a stereo power amp and then 2 speakers.

What are you using for stereo FX? There isn't much in the rack mounted FX units being made anymore.

And since you only need OD for one song, get a pedal, put it before the volume pedal. I just recorded a couple songs like that, it sounded great, client was happy. And you say you have the Blackbird, doesn't it have a clean channel and an OD channel? Is that not working for you? I had one for a while and thought it sounded pretty good.

Back in the late 80s, early 90s, rack stuff was big for guitar players. That era is gone and there is not very much made for that market in a long time. There maybe something like you are talking about out there, but if $1000 is too much, I don't know what you will find. I know, I've looked. But, good luck on your search, you may find someone out there making something like that. If you do, share, as I don't think most people would be aware of it.

You would need a stereo power amp anyway, there is that to consider as well

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Rich thanks for writing to me, I use the Black Bird and as I wrote it is perfect but it is a mono tube pedal that has the beautiful clean and the perfect drive channel with two options, but I wanted to make a different stereo rig using a 1 rack unit tube preamp for example the Mesa Boogie V-Twin, or the Brunetti Centouno, they are two stereo channel tube preamps. As a mono reverb I have been using the Neunaber Wet reverb V4 mono for years, and for the stereo reverb I will use the Neunaber Immerse reverberator mk ii stereo. Francesco

[Jerry Overstreet]

There are some current ones out there, just have to search them out.

But, I know. I've been through the same thing trying to find a 2 channel stereo rack as I'm no great guitar player but I do play and I need different sounds for guit and steel.

For many years I used the Tube Works Blue Tube II 924. It has a couple 12ax7 in there. Only issue is they are no longer built and the pots can get scratchy.

When the last one died, I looked around a long time without finding a suitable 1R unit at a price I could afford.

I found an 80s era Boss GL 100. No tubes, but 2 channel stereo with separate eqs etc. It cleans up nicely and has several of the Boss guitar pedals on the dirt channel. I'm using it with a MosValve 6L6 stereo amp and it works good for me.

[Francesco Porcu]

Hi Jerry, thank you for writing to me, I'm searching on the internet and there is something about handmade stereo tube preamps with stereo and two-channel fx loop outputs but I have to try the clean part with the speed to understand how it responds, these are designed for guitarists so you should try them first but how do you do it? You can't buy random preamps and spend a lot of money uselessly testing. Sooner or later I'll find a solution and I'll post it here in my post to share with you, maybe it could be helpful.

[Jerry Overstreet]

That would be most helpful Frank. Thanks for sharing.

[Francesco Porcu]

Jerry I'll give you some links where you'll see some very good historic stereo tube preamps that should be good for steel, take a look, I read in an old post here on the forum that a user in the 90s had used the Mesa Boogie W-Twin preamp and wrote that it was unbeatable even better than the Mesa Boogie Studio Preamp. Take a look at these 3 preamps, the Brunetti Centouno is manufactured in my town in Italy by a famous technician called Marco Brunetti, he makes world-famous amps.

https://reverb.com/it/item/39430403-bru ... tar-preamp
https://reverb.com/item/88868873-mesa-b ... rack-mount
https://reverb.com/en-pt/item/22403194- ... ula-preamp

This is a new generation preamp that intrigued me a lot but we'll have to see if the clean part is good for the steel

https://reverb.com/item/33334088-guitar ... etonator-p

https://www.yerasov.com/catalog/preamps ... ack-preamp