Slim Idaho ???

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 22 May 2002 9:53 pm

Slim was from my area.He died maybe 15 or 20 years before I was born.I've never heard any of his work.A lot of the old timers down this way think Slim was one of the best And had he lived, might have been another Emmons or Chalker.Was he really that great? Or just another really good steel player for the times? Did he sound like Murphey or Boggs? Or did he have his on thing going?These are just things I've wondered about over the years.Maybe some of you fellas will be kind enough to educate this youngster?

Just tell it like you remember it.Thanks -----bb

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 22 May 2002 10:48 pm

Very Very hot steel player. Rapid single notes,hardly done 'till then. Triple neck Rickenbacher, A six , a seven, a eight string neck. Killed in a motorcycle accident in Fredricksburg Virginia in 1947.
Last name originally spelled "Ahdeho" . Changed to "Idaho" when in his teens. His steel guitar is now owned by Harold Near in Richmond Va. I have been to the intersection where he was killed, a truly sad ending to a very great career.
R.K.S. III

Doug Seymour · Post by **Doug Seymour** » 23 May 2002 12:27 am

Thanks Bobbe!

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 23 May 2002 5:08 am

Very informative Bobbe.Thanks.Did his playing sound similar to J can't spell it. Pronounced Wa-keen Murphy? Garland Nash.You may have known him personally?Anything you would like to add.Anybody??I take it he died a young man??You guys feel free to jump in. Thanks again.------bb

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 23 May 2002 6:50 am

Spelling lesson is courtesy of Bobbe Seymour.

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 23 May 2002 6:54 am

He was a young man when he died. My Dad and uncle knew him in Roanoke, VA where he played on WDBJ radio with Tommy Magnus and others before going on to Richmond and The Old Dominion Barn Dance. He played with Sunshine Sue there. I heard that when he got killed on the motorcycle, the next show at the Barn Dance they set his steel up on stage, shined a spotlight on it and played The Silent Steel Guitar.

My Dad and Uncle both said they had never heard any one play the way he did. He was faster than greased lightning. My Uncle knew him better than my Dad did and said he was a great showman too. Very funny and entertaining. Even after his death they thought he was one of the best. From what I've heard, he would have been right up there with Emmons, Day, Chalker and others if he had lived and been better known.
Mike

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 23 May 2002 10:21 am

What he said! Joquine Murphy personified.
I would not have known any of this without Doug Seymour and Harold Near. I just listened and retained over the years. I do remember uncle Doug playing my some of Slims recording though, I remember it being very fast, wild,and way out there.
Bobbe (the spelling teacher) Seymour[This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 23 May 2002 at 11:42 AM.]

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 23 May 2002 5:11 pm

Yeah, he was awesome...far ahead of his time (and not only in his playing ability). Slim's first 3-neck guitar was made by bolting three single-neck guitars together. He did get teased about his "funny looking steel guitar", but he went right on playing it! I don't recall seeing a lot of 3-neck guitars around in that time period (early-to-mid '40s). They did get more popular in the late '40s, as Fender, Bigsby, and others started to mass-produce them.

Kenny Dail · Post by **Kenny Dail** » 23 May 2002 5:46 pm

I can't document this but...there was a musical publication that catered to Country Music and its performers. The name of the magazine escapes me. There was an article about Slim Idaho and he was posed with a picture of a triple neck Rick with his left arm resting in a non-playing position but totally revealing all 3 necks. I personally counted the strings and counted 8 strings on one neck but I cannot say that the other 2 necks were more or less. I was just a beginner on the Steel and was totally blown away about the 8 string neck(s). The point I am about to make is that his playing expertise was so admired by Alveno Rey that the guitar in question was especially made for him by Rickenbacher at Mr. Rey's request and was personally given to him by Mr. Rey. Two instrumentals he was noted for was "Honeysuckle Rose" and "Texas Playboy Rag". The magazine that I refer to preceded the well known "Country Song Roundup". I am sure the article was printed at about the time of his accident. I would tune in to WRVA on Saturday nights if the GOO was not clear and listen to Sue and catch Benny Collins, Benny Kissinger, Sam Workman, Joe Maphis, Granpa Jones and the list goes on and on... Slim was "his own musician" but you could here lines and phrases in his playing technique that you would later hear by the great Juaquin Murphy and Noel Boggs. I believe they may have been influenced by him. FWIW. This is not an attempt to perpetuate a myth but to reveal the facts as I interpreted them at that particular time.

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kd...and the beat goes on...

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 23 May 2002 7:03 pm

WOW! Kenny.You do place him in some mighty big company.If he played Juaquin riffs before Juaquin.That's very impressive.For some reason I had it in my mind that Slim died in the late 50's.So in my mind I had him playing maybe a Bigsby with pedals.Another thing.I thought Texas Playboy Rag was a Wills tune.By Herb Remington.No one mentioned Slim played with Wills.So I guess not.Thanks guys this is great.

I should mention that I played behind Slims brother Ken,now deceased, several times in the 70's. I was 12 or 13.Ken told me how great his brother was.But since I'd never heard of Slim Idaho except from the local guys. I kind of dismissed it as a proud brother bragging on a brother who had passed on.Anyone have any idea how old Slim was when he died?[This message was edited by Bobby Boggs on 23 May 2002 at 08:33 PM.]

Kenny Dail · Post by **Kenny Dail** » 24 May 2002 5:48 am

Bobby...I didn't mean to mislead you with the "Texas Playboy Rag" instrumental. I only wanted to say that is one of the few I can remember that he could do extremely well. I don't believe Slim ever recorded or toured with Bob Wills. As mentioned previously, he got killed in 1946 or 47. Do the arithmatic. To my knowledge my first awareness of Juaquin was with Cooley with "Oklahoma Stomp" and "SG Rag" as his claim that he had arrived on the scene. I think that the "Stomp" came out about 1948 or 49. "Steel Guitar Jubilee" was also a Juaquin original which came out about the same time. These are approximate dates so don't accept it as "gospel". "Texas Playboy Rag" was a Boggs original (?), I think, and it was cut with Wills by Noel.

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kd...and the beat goes on...

Jody Carver · Post by **Jody Carver** » 25 May 2002 6:52 am

Kenny
Every thing you posted is correct,,Boggs wrote and recorded "Texas Playboy Rag" while
he was with Wills. He has recorded that with
others as well,,,,he has three different versions of that tune,,most of them with Spade Cooley and another with Bill Boyd's Cowboy Ramblers and still another with Hank Penny.

My informer (Leo) told me,,Noel didnt care for Joaquins version of TPR with Tex Williams as Murph got away from the melody and did too much what Murph always did,,,,,
"stay off the melody".

Those are Leo's comments not mine. There was no jealousy between them (Noel & Murph) they were on good terms,,,but I guess sort of ,,,well you know what I mean

competition?,,,I thought both of them were great. The only steel player of today who could fill those shoes would be Tom Morell..he's got the touch and the best of everything,,,Happy to see you are feeling better,,,,stay that way,...

Im taking a "Hiatus" for the summer,,,,see you in the fall,,,,,Jody

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 25 May 2002 1:39 pm

after readin' this great thread, i went lookin' for a pic of Slim Idaho.
all i found was this one: www.hillbilly-music.com/artists/artist_details.cfm?artistid=12537
unfortunately they don't have no info on Slim
matter of fact i'm sendin' them this thread.
anybody else got some pics of Slim ?
Steel surfin' around...

[This message was edited by CrowBear Schmitt on 25 May 2002 at 02:42 PM.]

John Steele (deceased) · Post by **John Steele (deceased)** » 25 May 2002 3:34 pm

Crow Bear, that's a great idea... so I'll add this paragraph from a book called "Classic Country" (Charles K. Wolfe, Routledge Publishing) in the chapter about Tommy Magness, the fiddler that Mike mentioned, and the man who popularized "Orange Blossom Special" and "Black Mountain Rag";

"By June 1946 Tommy had formed his own band, Tommy Magness and the Orange Blossom Boys, an interesting band that was part western swing, part honky-tonk, and a touch of bluegrass. It included Clayton and Saford Hall (not related to Roy), Jay Hugh Hall (Roy's older brother), singer Warren Poindexter, and steel player Slim Idaho. Slim was one of the first to use an electric pedal steel, and Tommy's announcer always referred to him as "big Slim Idaho with his strange three-necked steel guitar" - suggesting that he either made his own instrument (as did many early pedal players) or was using one of the very first Fender pedal steels. Idaho was a remarkable instrumentalist and a key innovator on the pedal steel; he later played on WRVA and became known for his stunning work on Cowboy Copas' "Jamboree" single of 1949. With Tommy, he helped play the band's theme song "Orange Blossom Special" of course - and did take-off solos on items like "Texas Playboy Rag".

"In September 1947, the band recorded its only commercial record, for the Roanoke-based Blue Ridge label: "Sittin' on Top of the World", backed with a new train instrumental, "Powhatan Arrow".

"But then, in April 1947, Acuff returned to his niche at the Grand Ole Opry, and made Tommy an offer to return to the more settled lifestyle there. Tommy broke up his Roanoke band and moved back to Nashville".

I hope this is relevant and interesting. I have copied this directly from the book, and although I find the references to "pedals" questionable (considering the time frame) I can't personally say for sure. The mention of Copas' 1949 hit is a bit puzzling as well, but I know some of Copas' records were released after his demise... and perhaps after Slim Idaho's as well.
-John [This message was edited by John Steele on 25 May 2002 at 05:48 PM.]

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 26 May 2002 3:27 pm

i just got a reply from www.hillbilly-music.com after sendin'them this thread.
Dave Sichak writes:
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there's a mention of Slim Idaho in the January 1947 issue of "Mountain Broadcast and Prairie Recorder"(page 23) "South of the Mason Dixon Line" column by Juanita Milligan:
"Idaho Slim along with his Steel Guitar is now being heard with Paul Howard from WSM.
This is the guy who played with Jack Gillette
and the Tennessee Ramblers from WBT, while making a guest appearance at the Tennessee Barn Dance a few weeks ago. He is quite a well known guitar player and can he play ?
Give him a listen !"
Montana Jack Gillette was a Violin player and played "many queer Musical novelties" and some kind of slip horn he called a "Poobaphone" which he created with Louis Prima's band in 1928.
the only other mention of him (Slim?)i've found so far is from the December 1947 issue #4 of the Song and Picture Barn Dance Magazine and lists him as part of the "Old Dominion Barn Dance Show" but little mention of the show or details on the cast members.
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Do you know if anyone has any biographical details on Slim Idaho such as date of birth,date of death so i can at least update the database?
there's a lot of nice information in that discussion thread you sent me-but i don't know if i can rightly use it.
---------------------------------------------
anybody who wants to help Dave update Slim Idaho's page can write him at:
sidetrak@hillbilly-music.com
Steel keepin' up on the past...

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 26 May 2002 4:10 pm

John,
I remember that my dad and uncle said he was playing things without pedals at that time. They said that nobody in our part of the country knew what pedals were then.
From what I understand Alvino Rey and Speedy West were useing them on the west coast in the 40's but they said Slim stood up and the only thing he had was a volume pedal. One more note though, my uncle said that Slim also could play the trumpet.
Also his real name was Dewey Albert.
I take an interest in this subject because of the stories I heard of Slim while growing up.
My father formed a band after the war with Bill Sloan on fiddle, Jim Janney on guitar, his baby brother Howard Sweeney on lead guitar and lap steel, and Saford Hall on bass. My dad Willard Sweeney played rythem guitar and the worked shows with Jay Hugh Hall and The Blue Ridge Entertainers along with playing shows on their own including the Blue Ridge Jamboree at the City Market Auditorium in Roanoke on W.R.O.V. Dad and uncle Howard also freelanced around doing radio shows with different people on stations likeW.D.B.J. , W.R.O.V. , W.R.A.D.,W.P.U.V. and others. They worked one radio show on W.R.O.V. in Roanoke then got in the car and drove like a bat out of hell to make it out to Colonial Ave. to W.D.B.J. just to see Tommy Magnus's show and hear Slim play. They talked about him in awe and reverance till they died. If he had that impact on them I know he had to be something else.
Mike

Kenny Dail · Post by **Kenny Dail** » 26 May 2002 10:13 pm

CrowbBear: The picture from your link is similar to the picture I remembered seeing as mentioned previously. Same pose but in a different jacket. The jacket I remembered in the picture was a buckskin with fringe on the sleeves. I do not think the Steel in your link's picture is a bolted together composite. I tried counting the strings on the necks and counted 8 on each of the outside necks and 6 on the middle neck but saw nothing to indicate a home made rig. I believe that Alveno Rey is still living and he might be able to add some credibility to my statement as to the "gift".

John Steele: Thanks for your input re the "Orange Blossom Boys". I have, or use to have, a taped radio broadcast of Tommy Mangus and the Orange Blossom Boys doing an early morning live radio broadcast from the studios of a Roanoke, Va. radio station in 1946. Other musicians were Warren Poindexter, Jay Hugh and Slim Idaho. While Tommy may have popularized the "Orange Blossom Special", It was written by my present wife's Great Uncle Ervin Rouse. The first known recording of the OBS was done by Ervin on fiddle and his brother Stoney playing rythm guitar recorded in 1929 with words similar to the words used on the great Johnny Cash's vocal arrangement. I have never heard anywhere that Slim ever used anything other than a volume pedal so far a pedals are concerned.

Mike Sweeney: Enjoyed your comments also. FWIW, Jay Hugh Hall was half of a duet team while working with Wade Mainer and "Mainer's Mountaineers" eminating from WPTF in Raleigh, N.C. 1937. The other half of this team was Clyde Moody who later became known as the "Carolina Woodchopper" and in 1940 became a member of Bill Monroe's "Bluegrass Boys" playing rythm guitar and is credited with the famous guitar lick done while playing in the open chord of "E" he would lift his index finger up and down quickly off and on the 3rd string. The "lick" was first used on a song called "6 White Horses". I seem to recall that Hank
Williams Sr. used a simioar style when he recorded "Honky Tonk Blues". While Jay and Clyde were with Wade Mainer, they were known as "The Carolina Sweethearts" (chuckle

) Clyde Moody went on to become "The Waltz King" when he recorded "Kentucky Waltz" and the "The Shanandoah Valley of Virginia" watlz. Lester Flatt Replaced Clyde with Monroe later as he tried to capitalize on being the "Waltz King".

I'm gettin' tired...think I'll quit for now. May have more later if anyone is interested.

In the words of the Great Jody Carver. I hope I am not becoming a bore. I too would like to apologize to b0b and the others that might find this stuff to be a waste of time. Choa...

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kd...and the beat goes on...

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 26 May 2002 11:18 pm

Safford Hall had a brother named Clayton Hall who also played music.
The radio station that Tommy Magnus as well as Don Reno And Red Smiley worked out of was W.D.B.J. which is a C.B.S. affiliate t.v. station and has been forever.
The latter group played a morning t.v. show there untill they broke up in '66 or '67. It was hosted by Irvin Sharpe who did the farm report weather and local news it came on at 6:00 a.m.
I was up every morning to watch it. A couple of sidemen from that group moved to Nashville to make names for themselves. Mac Mc Geaha and Steve Chapman.
Roanoke used to be a hotbed for music but sad to say those days are gone.
Back to the subject now. I wish I could hear some of the transcriptions of Tommy Magnus's show with Slim Idaho just to hear what my dad and uncle were raving about.
Kenny, Jay Hugh took over the Blue Ridge Entertainers after his brother Roy Hall who started the band died in a car wreck their brother Rufus Hall the last I heard still lived in the Roanoke area but that has been a while back. I checked out the link and thats funny that I almost forgot Wayne Flemming. He was and is a great player. His son Jerry is a great steel player and good friend of mine. Mike
Mike[This message was edited by Mike Sweeney on 27 May 2002 at 12:23 AM.][This message was edited by Mike Sweeney on 27 May 2002 at 12:35 AM.]

Vernon Hester · Post by **Vernon Hester** » 27 May 2002 8:37 am

I remember Slim with sunshine Sue as well as his backup with Claude Casey on "Little Red Wagon". He was a way ahead of his time with Curly and Jouquin Licks. that came later
Best
Vern

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 27 May 2002 10:22 am

first awareness of Juaquin was with Cooley with "Oklahoma Stomp" and "SG Rag" as his claim that he had arrived on the scene. I think that the "Stomp" came out about 1948 or 49.

Oaklahoma Stomp was recorded on May 3, 1946. With all due respect, I think Joaquin was influenced by the jazz and swing players of the late '30s and early '40s.

Slim was one of the first to use an electric pedal steel, and Tommy's announcer always referred to him as "big Slim Idaho with his strange three-necked steel guitar" - suggesting that he either made his own instrument (as did many early pedal players) or was using one of the very first Fender pedal steels. Idaho was a remarkable instrumentalist and a key innovator on the pedal steel;

Again with all due respect, Fender did not make pedal steels in the '40s and the first Bigsby pedal steel was Feb 1948. The only commercial pedal steel that I know of at that time was the Gibson Electraharp starting circa 1938.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 27 May 2002 11:28 am

Chas, some people who aren't familiar with the steel equate a "stand-up multi-neck" non-pedal steel with the pedal steel. No doubt, the author of that article is one of them. Stand up multi-necks are much more massive and obvious than the "lap steels" everyone was familiar with, so the error is forgivable. In all my years, I have heard many great things about Slim, but as you have surmised, Slim and the true "pedal steel" probably never got together. Though Gibson's "Electraharp" had been around before Slim's death, they were quite rare, and local few country players could afford the several hundred dollar outlay to get one. Back then, $5-$7 a night was considered good wages for a local musician. Most made less.

Kenny Dail · Post by **Kenny Dail** » 27 May 2002 12:57 pm

Chas...I am in no way trying to give you accurate dates on these I have posted. I was merely 17 in 1946 and my first awareness of the Stomp was probably around the dates posted. I do not know or claim to know the recorded dates...especially instrumentals because you have to research them to get this kind of input. And...this kind of input was not available to me in my early years. For all I knew at the time, Spade Cooley could have been the steeler. Had never heard of Joaquin 'til many years later.

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kd...and the beat goes on...

John Steele (deceased) · Post by **John Steele (deceased)** » 27 May 2002 2:23 pm

Mike and Chas, thank you for the clarification. I had assumed the author had made an error with respect to "pedals".
This has been a tremendously interesting thread.
Kenny, in the same book there is a little blurb about OBS, and the fact that your wife's relative was the writer (They even named him). It also contains the story of how Tommy M. recorded the tune but the recording was held up for copyright reasons. Shortly afterward Mr. Rouse, the writer of OBS, recorded it, and that was the first released recording. Tommy Magness' version, which was allegedly earlier, never saw the light of day until a compilation CD was issued by Columbia in the year 2000. I hope that is interesting to you - and if you'd like me to e-mail the several paragraphs from the book, I would be glad to. Just drop me a line. Sorry to stray off topic.
I would also love to hear some of these early recordings/transcriptions featuring Slim Idaho. Perhaps someone will release them someday.
-John

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 27 May 2002 2:42 pm

Donny & Kenny--my reply above, wasn't meant to be hostile or to detract from Slim. Anytime someone who is so talented is lost, we all lose and can only imagine what could have been.

Joaquin was 22 when he recorded Oklahoma Stomp.

Jussi Huhtakangas · Post by **Jussi Huhtakangas** » 27 May 2002 9:44 pm

German Cattle-Records has released a Paul Howard album (vinyl) and three of the tracks feature Slim Idaho. Those were recorded in September -46. His style indeed is somewhat like Murphy's, though I doubt neither of the gentlemen really influenced each other. Billy Bowman is on the rest of the tracks of the album. Guitar players ( twin lead ) are Jabbo Arrington and a very young Hank Garland.
Jussi