BIAB Q: Sustain last chord - like a real band?

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 23 Oct 2004 3:00 am

And since we're on a BIAB roll here...

Does anyone know how to get BIAB to hold the very last chord of a tune for more than one measure? You know, like the way a real band might play that last chord and hang on it for a while while instruments sustain and fade out a bit?

For instance, on a typical I/V/I last bar (root on beat one, fifth on beat two, root on beat three - and held for about 3 or 4 seconds?)

Would you somehow "tie" that last chord to the next measure - telling the drummer to shut up? If so how? (I know how to tell the drummer to shut up - both live and in BIAB!

Or can you retard just the last two beats of the measure so that the last chord plays longer?

Thanks very very much in advance! This has been driving me nuts! Best, -Dave

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Mullen D-10 - It's still one smooooth puppy!
Photo page: http://www.davidhorch.com/music

George Wixon · Post by **George Wixon** » 23 Oct 2004 4:15 am

Hi Dave,
Go to my site at www.gwixon.com and click on the page for "Holding A Chord." Everything is shown exactly how to to do this. You can also push the chord out before you start the hold like this ^^C (just an example).
George

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 23 Oct 2004 6:21 pm

Thanks for the tip George. I knew how to enter the "C..." (three dots) to indicate holding a chord, but using this for the very last chord of a song doesn't seem to work (for me).

The only work around I found is entering the C..., then nothing (blank) in the following measure, then another "C..." in the next measure. This will hold the first "C...", then strangly enough play a "shot" type for that second "C...".

If I don't enter that second "C..." two bars later, the first "C..." just plays and cuts out rather abruptly when the next (blank) measure starts. I really don't want to have to force the hold with that second "C...", but that's the only way I've found so far.

Anybody got any more ideas? Thanks again, -Dave

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 23 Oct 2004 8:52 pm

Yeah, Dave. Check your settings for the total number of bars of the song. If you set it to run from bar #1 to, say, bar #32, and you put your C... in bar #32, it won't sustain the chord because there is no bar #33 to sustain it into! So, you need to tell it that there is a tag ending, which starts after bar 32 (in this example), starts on bar 33 and ends at, say, bar 35. Then in bar 35, put a DIFFERENT chord, let's say C#. with a SINGLE dot after it, instead of three dots. Now, BIAB will hit your C chord on bar 32, sustain it till bar 35 and then stop (don't worry, it won't play the C# chord).
Try it and report back, okay?
Good luck,
Jimbeaux

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 24 Oct 2004 3:26 am

Jim - Thanks the reply. AHAA! Use a chord "rest" (single dot after the chord) to fake the program out!! You're a genius!

I already had the intro, "chorus" (3x), and tag section built, but getting my last (desired) chord in the tag to sustain was the problem. Your suggestion did the trick! Thank you!

Now - New topic - Bug Report (?): When I changed my last "C..." (which was my orginal workaround, see above) to Jim's suggested "C." (forced rest) - the screen updated to display the "C." correctly. BUT, when I told BIAB to play the newly edited tune, it played the "old" way I had it! Huh? Workaround: I saved the changes, then reopened the file - it then played as I had expected (with the rest). Am I missing a "do what I told you to" button somewhere, or is this an "undocumented feature"? -Dave[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 24 October 2004 at 04:26 AM.]

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 24 Oct 2004 5:53 am

Simplest way is to CHANGE THE SONG TEMPO to one at half or a quarter of the speed, at the last bar !! (write the tempo change in the bar properties)

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Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 26 Oct 2004 8:36 pm

When I changed my last "C..." (which was my orginal workaround, see above) to Jim's suggested "C."

Dave, I didn't suggest "C.", I suggested "C#." or any other chord EXCEPT "C." Try that and see if it helps. I think it has to be a different chord from the sustaining chord.

mickd · Post by **mickd** » 27 Oct 2004 1:10 am

on BIAB vn 10, i generally find that I have to do what Dave said (save, exit, reload song) for certain changes to get actioned.
I assume its a bug but I can live with it

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 27 Oct 2004 4:28 am

Jim - you're correct, of course. You DID write "put a DIFFERENT chord, let's say C#". What I meant to say was that you suggested a rest (single dot), to force the chord hold. Note that this tune had an intro, repeated "chorus" section, and a "tag" ending, because...

Interesting enough - and follow this - I used a "C" (same chord as the some I wanted to sustain/hold) on that tune and it worked. THEN, when building a different tune, that did not have a "tag" ending (the whole tune was built with no repeats), I did have to enter a DIFFERENT chord (with a dot/rest) after my desired ending sustained chord to get the previous chord to sustain - just as Jim suggested. Why did the two tune structures respond differently - who knows... Weird. Perhaps another "undocumented feature"...

Mickd - glad to know that the save-and-reload thing is not just me! Thanks for that. Perhaps someone at pgmusic will catch it and fix it. It's hard to believe they haven't noticed. Btw/ I'm running "BIAB 2004" now, but my version 9 did the same thing.

-Dave[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 27 October 2004 at 05:39 AM.]

Ole Dantoft · Post by **Ole Dantoft** » 27 Oct 2004 9:06 am

Dave Horch, mickd,
You don't have to save and reload the song, just push the play-button (or hit F4) to let BIAB re-generate the song. If you don't it'll simply play the arrangement it already has in memory and your newly entered changes will seem to be ignored !

Ole

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 28 Oct 2004 2:10 am

Thanks Ole. I was just pressing the space bar to play the tune once I modified it. I guess that does not refresh it. Thanks again for the tip. -Dave

mickd · Post by **mickd** » 28 Oct 2004 11:07 am

I always did hit the 'play' button (I didnt even know about the space bar shortcut) so I think there most definitely is a bug. Maybe it only affects 10.0 ?

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 29 Oct 2004 1:23 am

mickd - That "spacebar shortcut" (to make BIAB play your tune by pressing the spacebar) is an option in the program, but I don't think it's the default. Go to Options/Preferences and look for a dropdown list for SPACEBAR key. Select "plays from start".

I use an extension cord on my computer keyboard so I can put it right next to my steel. Once I have my picks on, I hit that spacebar and start practicing. Very convenient. -Dave[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 29 October 2004 at 04:36 PM.]

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 30 Oct 2004 4:59 am

Dave .. did the tempo thing not do the trick.. and if not .. why ?
Baz

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 30 Oct 2004 4:32 pm

Jim Cohen was right. Do it like you started, C... then where you want the hold to end, place any chord except C and add a single dot(rest). I,ve been using the program since Kermit was a tadpole, and I've never had that bug you mentioned. There's a lot of good info on the PGMusic forum about it.

Dave Horch · Post by **Dave Horch** » 31 Oct 2004 2:53 am

Baz - I never tried it, since Jim's suggestion did exactly what I was intending to do. I do thank you very much and will give it a shot in the future. Cheers, -Dave[This message was edited by Dave Horch on 31 October 2004 at 02:54 AM.]