Something New!

Keith Hilton · Post by **Keith Hilton** » 8 Feb 2003 10:26 pm

I have built this really great sounding Wah Wah for Steel Guitar. Everyone else has put their Wah Wah in a pedal. If not a pedal, then connected to a Envelope arrangement which creates a Wha Wah in relation to string attack. I have some fresh new ideas! What would be wrong with having the Wah Wah operated from a knee lever, or even a elbow lever? The knee lever could even be attached to the leg of the steel as a easy attachment. Here is a couple more ideas; The Wah Wah could even be operated by pressing a button. A fellow on the Forum was recently talking about a "WHAMMY" button or lever. Well! That's easy! Do you know that a Wah Wah put on a automatic control creates? It creates a Leslie Organ effect?[This message was edited by Keith Hilton on 08 February 2003 at 10:28 PM.]

Robert Thomas · Post by **Robert Thomas** » 9 Feb 2003 5:05 am

How much would it cost for the wah, wah lever attached to the leg of the PSG?

Keith Hilton · Post by **Keith Hilton** » 9 Feb 2003 8:30 am

Robert, I have not thought about price. I just finished the Wah Wah circuit and have been thinking of unique ways a player could control it. Everything out there is made for 6 string standard stand up guitar players. Nothing is really made for steel players first! I am one of the few people in the world inventing new electronic stuff for the steel guitar.[This message was edited by Keith Hilton on 09 February 2003 at 08:31 AM.]

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 9 Feb 2003 9:38 am

I really liked the concept of the old Goodrich volume/wah pedal, maybe you could incorporate yours inside your pedal somewhat like that.

It was a standard sized photocell pedal that ran off AC. There was an on/off pushbutton switch inside the pedal at the toe position. (I think it would have been better at the heel.) It had a wah volume pot with a large round knob on the left side of the pedal so you could control it with your left foot to match your normal volume. It had a toggle switch, also on the left side (I think) for two different kinds of wah. It was cool!

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 9 Feb 2003 10:55 am

Keith, Maybe you could get a prototype built and bring it to Iowa with you?

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1985 Emmons push-pull, Session 500, Nashville400, 65 re-issue Fender Twin, Fender Tele

Johan Jansen · Post by **Johan Jansen** » 9 Feb 2003 12:53 pm

Keith, please let me know if you and when you have a prototype
Thanks, JJ

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Click on the pic!

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 9 Feb 2003 4:25 pm

I'm not really interested in a "Wah-Wah" effect per se, but you might could talk me into buying a small, leg-mounted Leslie effect, if it sounded good...

Dave Birkett · Post by **Dave Birkett** » 9 Feb 2003 5:20 pm

Are we talking about a wah-wah effect à la Hendrix or a Jerry Byrd type effect?

Robert Thomas · Post by **Robert Thomas** » 9 Feb 2003 5:38 pm

Keith.
I have used a Bigsby vol/tone pedal for 50 years or more. I switched to your pedal and I just love it, but I really miss the wah, wah effect. If you come up with something as I mentioned earlier, I would really be interested.

Larry Beck · Post by **Larry Beck** » 9 Feb 2003 6:47 pm

Keith:
I have had a brand X pedal for years that uses 2 - 12 volt car lights and a photoresistor. When depressed all the way, additional pressure will switch to wah mode.
Volume goes to a preset level.(adjustable)
There are two ranges of wah on a switch located on the side of the pedal.

This system works well for me.

Keith Hilton · Post by **Keith Hilton** » 9 Feb 2003 7:09 pm

Dave, good question. To answer your question, "Hendrix" type Wah Wah. Actually it is a low pass filter, with a center/resonate frequency that moves. The Jerry Byrd Wah Wah, might be called a Do Wah.
It involved a simpler tone circuit that changed trebble to bass and back quickly. Seems to me either one of these would work well with a knee lever attached to the leg of a steel. Or a elbow lever!

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 9 Feb 2003 9:02 pm

Larry Beck, I think you and I are talking about the same pedal. That was really a great idea, especially back when I was really into the Rusty Young B3 and Cry Baby Wah-Wah sounds.

I gave all that up for the weight when the auto-wah pedals and the Leslie simulators came out, but they just don't sound the same. I "get by" with my MIDI rig and B3 samples now.

Kenny Dail · Post by **Kenny Dail** » 9 Feb 2003 9:16 pm

Keith, instead of attaching it to the leg of the steel or a knee lever, why not make it so that you could plug it into the steel endplate like the "Boss Tone". You could activate the desired "do-waa" similar to the way Speedy worked the tone pot on his Bigsby end plate.

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kd...and the beat goes on...

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 9 Feb 2003 11:19 pm

I'm not sure I have enough mental "bandwidth" to operate a wah-wah in addition to everything else. Maybe if I squeezed it with my teeth....

Dave Boothroyd · Post by **Dave Boothroyd** » 10 Feb 2003 12:49 am

So it looks as if you are going to have to add an LFO to your circuit to give a Leslie effect, an envelope follower so that it will Auto Wah, so while you are at it why not look into something like a Roland D beam system, so that you could control the filter by your body postion?
Does anyone use a Korg Kaoss Pad with steel? - mind you, I'm not sure what you would actually touch the screen with that you are not using already- perhaps we better not go there!!
Cheers
Dave

Lynn Kasdorf · Post by **Lynn Kasdorf** » 10 Feb 2003 10:32 am

Sounds good, Keith

There are two issues here- the electronics and the control.

First, on the electronics, I'd suggest you allow some adjustment of Q. I play an old passive Fender tone pedal with my stringmaster, and it lets you do a tone-swell, for western swing. It is passive, and hence very low Q. It also is dependent on the source impedance- it will not work if you run through a buffer amp (ala matchbox).

But this is not sharp enough for a real wah-wah effect, ala Rusty Young. I recently acquired an orignal Cry-Baby wah and it is very sharp indeed. This is good for various rock effects, but would be too much for traditional western swing.

It would be great to have a pedal that does both kinds of wah (low Q and high Q), and everything in between.

Regarding the actuator for this, I've thought of a number of approaches. I've always wanted a spring loaded wrist lever for doing this. It would have to be very low mass and low friction, so that it could be tweaked quickly.

Alternatively, a momentary pushbutton switch, with just the right feel and just the right size and shape button in just the right place, would be very cool for doing quick "do-wahs".

How about integrating wah into your pedal, and provide a small wired (or wireless!) mode switch that clips onto a leg of the steel, so you can quickly go in and out of wah mode? When a wah pedal is in the "dark" position, it is lower apparent volume, so you don't really need a volume pedal AND a wah pedal at the same time, IMHO.

Of course, a pedal like this would cost as much as my steel...

Keep those great products comin'!

Fred Shannon · Post by **Fred Shannon** » 10 Feb 2003 10:56 am

[This message was edited by Fred Shannon on 06 December 2004 at 02:18 AM.]

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 10 Feb 2003 5:12 pm

Keith. You remind me of a recent discovery I made using a Q-tron envelope filter (auto wah). I found that if the threshold on the Q-tron was set right that by merely using the volume pedal I could make it respond like a wah pedal. The more volume pedal, the more the wah sweeps upward. I had the greatest blend of envelope filter and wah wah going on and my foot never left the (Hilton) volume pedal. Is that what you're referring to?

Brad Sarno

Cairo Zoots · Post by **Cairo Zoots** » 10 Feb 2003 5:24 pm

Hi Keith, Not that I'm tired of the "Wah" effect, but wouldn't it be exciting to have a "Wo" or (for higher string-octave playing) a "Weee" or "Waaay"? AND while you're at it, how 'bout a microsecond crunch attack in the beginning-that quickly resolves to a portamento-ish slide down or up to the octave. The time spent going up or down, would have the same feel & sound as a drummer doing a press roll, but would be frequency sensitive. Now here's the Kicker-----the whole thing would be controlled by the bar location in relation to sensors located on/in the neck. Each sensor would have an associated electronics module which could be purchased separately depending on what effect was desired. Bar mass, and pressure would be the dominating factors in the final sound. (I'll leave it to U to work out the details

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ree00deedoo