What amp do you use if not a steel amp??

Patrick Smith · Post by **Patrick Smith** » 2 Nov 2001 8:20 am

Although better sounding, a twin or vibrosonic is too heavy to carry up and down these stairs.

Well, it's all a matter of training....see, I started hauling twins with JBLs and 4 x 12 Marshall cabs....then reduced to just twins with JBLs....then to a twin with a single 15" BW

By the time I got to the twin/BW, my "mind was right" as Cool Hand Luke would say!....ha!

Kinda like lugging an old Sho Bud Pro II around, then picking up an Emmons....by then the Emmons doesn't feel bad at all!....it's all in the training!.....

PMS
Britney's twin-totin' big boy!

Rob van Duuren · Post by **Rob van Duuren** » 2 Nov 2001 11:18 pm

Patrick, i re-read your post about your modified old twin. i have a question. i own an old 64 Bassman top with one guitarinput
using one preamptube and a bassinput using
two tubes. all are 7025's. Now the circuitry
of the bassinput isn't standard already so i was curious if you'd have a suggestion how to redesign the circuit to turn it into a good-
sounding 'steel'input. You seem to have experience with this. hope to hear from you.
BTW, i am probably gonna put the vibrosonic into a seperate cabinet to take care of the weight, also handy to have the amp closer at hand while playing. rob.

Keith DeLong · Post by **Keith DeLong** » 3 Nov 2001 2:34 am

My "other amp", which I use for guitar, is a 1964 Fender Super Reverb, sounds good playing at home at low volume but on a gig it would get somewhat distorted. I've never tried using it with my Peavey Nashville, but that might be interesting. The Nashville 400 is not modified, and does sound a bit harsh--everyone tells me that the modification helps that a lot.

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 3 Nov 2001 3:47 am

I don't use any 'steel amps'.

Most of the time I usde either a THD Univalve or a prototype THD 'Deco' amp. These are about 15 watts each, and are plenty loud with a good PA. Sometimes I use both. Sometimes I use a 60s Showman, which is as loud as you would ever want to get without risking ear damage. If I do need to play too loud, I'll add a VHT 2/50/2 or a VHT 2/90/2 tube power amp to one of the THDs, running from the line out of the THD.

I don't use EQs or very many effects. IMHO the best sound is a great sounding small tube amp. Once you have that sound, it's a whole lot easier to make that great tone sound loud than it is to make a loud steel amp sound great.

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www.tyacktunes.com

Patrick Smith · Post by **Patrick Smith** » 3 Nov 2001 2:25 pm

Rob,

I just pulled the blackface bassman layout from:
http://www.ampwares.com/ffg/

According to a couple of very knowlegable buddies, the "deep swich" on the bassman is pretty bogus. If I remember correctly there's an additional cap before the tone stack which strips bottom end, the deep switch just puts it back to normal....Also, I see in the layout that the bass and mid tone caps on the bass channel are .1 and .1 respectively....the bass pot is a 10KA and the treble pot is 50K....on the normal channel the tone caps are .1 and .047 as in a twin, and the bass and treble pots are 250KA and 250KA. The slope resistor for each channel is 100K.

You could certainly play around with the "bass channel"....I'd dump the stripping cap (the deep switch). If you look at the '55-60 bassman, there's a 1MA bass pot!....that right there will probably drastically increase your volume! If it were me, I'd leave the normal channel stock, take the bass channel and:

-dump the deep switch and make it into a bright switch with a 500pF mica cap. This will bring more high end than you ever thought possible which will go very well with the bass pot change below

-change the bass pot to 1M and the treble pot to 250K

-change the 250pF ceramic treble cap to a 250pF mica cap

-change the bass and mid caps each to .022, I put in the Mallory 150 axials

-change the slope resistor to 56K

This thing would probably now kill!....LOL Thing is, you only spent about 10 bucks and the normal channel is untouched

Hope this helps

PMS

PS-You can get all these parts from Hoffman amps www.hoffmanamps.com Doug Hoffman is one of the coolest folks you'll ever deal with...responds immediately and usually ships out the same day.

[This message was edited by Patrick Smith on 03 November 2001 at 02:29 PM.]

Hamilton Barnard · Post by **Hamilton Barnard** » 3 Nov 2001 7:16 pm

Dan, I just bought a Univalve. That's all I will say is that they are...interesting.

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My Marshalls.

Rob van Duuren · Post by **Rob van Duuren** » 4 Nov 2001 12:02 am

Patrick, thanks very,very much for these hints. It will probably take a few days to carry everything out, but I'm really curious.
My model doesn't have the deep switch, but the rest must be quite similar as I found in the TUBE AMP BOOK by Aspen. I'll start soldering and will let you know if and how the amp sounds afterwards.......rob.

Rob van Duuren · Post by **Rob van Duuren** » 4 Nov 2001 1:02 am

Patrick, just checked the site you referred to. Found out my amp is the model 6G6-A. I hope this won't interfere with the alterations you suggested. This amp hasn't got mid-tone and a deep switch.Rob.

Patrick Smith · Post by **Patrick Smith** » 6 Nov 2001 9:19 am

Rob, just read your post....I looked at the layout for your amp and it's a little different....at least the bass channel is.....this isn't the standard blackface/silver face circuit that I'm familiar with...the normal channel is...you can see the tone stack with a .1, .05, and 250pF tone caps, and the 100K slope resistor.

Off the top of my head, the tweed tone stack would be .022, .022, mica 250pF caps, and a 56K slope resistor....with 1M bass and 250K treble pots....if you have any questions you could certainly ask some of the Fender gurus over at the Guitar amp board....to be honest, if this is truly a blonde 64, then all IMHO, but I'm not sure I'd do too much tweeking around with it....these are kinda rare, plus there're too many silver face amps out there for very little money that can be turned into little monsters

Hope any of this helps!

PMS

PS-you can find the Fender gurus here:
http://www.firebottle.com/fireforum/fireBB.cgi?select=ganews&first_days_old= [This message was edited by Patrick Smith on 06 November 2001 at 09:20 AM.]

Dave Van Allen · Post by **Dave Van Allen** » 6 Nov 2001 9:27 am

I played through a silverface and a blackface twin two weeks ago, neither one made we want to go back to tubes.

yeah, Jack.. but did you go thru BOTH OF 'EM at the same time!?

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 6 Nov 2001 10:29 am

I don´t have any "steel amps" either. For gigs, nothing comes close to my Fender Twin, my current one is a 135 watt Silverface with 2 x 12" JBL speakers. In my opinion, there´s no way a 15" speaker has that punch that two 12"s have got. But that´s a matter of taste. The only other thing I´d like to try someday would be an older, "Blackface" model or maybe a Dual Showman with cabinet.
Now and then I also use my old MusicMan 210-65, it´s a great guitar amp but doesn´t adapt very well to live situations with the steel. At high volumes it tends to get very harsh. It´s got so much treble that it almost blows my head off, so- if at all- I´ll use it only for small sessions or at home.
But for home practicing I normally use a small Dean Markley K-20 that doesn´t sound too bad with headphones.

Patrick Smith · Post by **Patrick Smith** » 6 Nov 2001 11:03 am

....there´s no way a 15" speaker has that punch that two 12"s have got.

I used to feel that way exactly!.....now, I like both....I love two 12's but man! a twin with 2 JBL D120Fs is almost more weight than it's worth....that's why I rebuilt and went with a single 15"....sounds fantastic for steel and shaved what feels like a good 20 pounds off of the thing...It's very doable now

PMS

CT · Post by CT » 8 Nov 2001 1:26 pm

Mesa Boogie TriAxis pre Amp through Boss GT3 EFX; Mesa Boogie 20/20 Amp. 2 Mesa Celestions. Not at all traditional but it sounds good to me. I tried to go back to my old Music Man HD 130 w 2 12s but it just didn't sound as good.

Doug Earnest · Post by **Doug Earnest** » 9 Nov 2001 5:16 pm

I've been using my new Fender Cyber Twin on some jobs, and I think I like it! It isn't the loudest amp, but it sure is handy with the built in effects and headphone amp. I like it for guitar, also.

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Doug Earnest
Zum2000U12,Sierra12,Sho-Bud ProII D10 PV DPC 750 ProFex 112E, Fender Cyber Twin